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Manchester United v Real Madrid – which is the bigger club and why?

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Soccerlens reader (and Real Madrid fan) Ramos writes in:

Re: “The Football Debt League – Top 10 Most Indebted Clubs by: Ross Mackiewicz

That was a really good article and I applaud the writer for having done his research into the numbers and for having put forward an unbiased view of those numbers too. However, I’d like to point a glaring error, that stood out to me, personally.

“Manchester United is a proven example. They are arguably the biggest football club in the world along with Real Madrid.”

This is factually incorrect. Real Madrid are the biggest football club in the world. Period. Manchester United lags behind this greatest of football clubs in every criteria that one could use to rank big clubs, save for the number of fans in Asia that each club has. To be more specific, you could say that “Manchester United, along with Barcelona, are the second biggest football clubs after Real Madrid”. Please refrain from making the same error again. By referring to Manchester United as a club that is equal to Madrid, you are doing a huge disservice to all the contributions that so many legends of the game have made to football through Real Madrid, and would be ignoring the consistent glory that the club, itself, has achieved through time. You would also be paying homage to Sky Sports instead of to all these legends, is that what you want? I hope not, for the sake of the beautiful game. Thank you and keep up the good work. icon smile Manchester United v Real Madrid   which is the bigger club and why?

This raises an interesting question – what is the criteria you would use to rank how ‘big’ a football club is? Trophies? Great teams? Great players? Do historical trophies count as much as recent performances? Is money a factor? Is the club’s financial worth important?

Tell us what you think in the comments below, and share your thoughts on which of United and Madrid is the bigger club.

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Comments (36)

  1. trophies. great teams. great players. historical trophies. recent performances. money. they all matter equally. you can’t truly judge the consistency of a football club unless you compare the club’s historical trophies with recent performances. great players will always count as a plus because great players will go to big clubs. great teams matters and it goes without saying. and it also matters how the club’s administration has handled the club’s money. how much did they spend on players, infrastructure, etc.

    and even though i’m a barca fan, madrid is bigger than united.

  2. Measured by the amount of debt a club can sustain, United is the biggest club in the world.
    Measured by the intelligence and sweet disposition of its manager, United is the biggest club in the world.
    Measured by decades of corrupt interference in its own league in its favour by a brutal dictator, RM is the biggest club in the world.

  3. In the current climate RM hold all the cards im a UTD fan and believe there isnt a level playing field on which to judge this . Tax Breaks ,Government and Backing of financal institutions keep Rm at the top of the heap . Barca in football terms lead .

  4. Greatnes is the sum total of a club’s football and other activities. Real may have won countless trophies, but ones who think they did by only fair means are kidding themselves. Real aren’t even the “greatest” team in Spain, let alone the world.
    The cruelties mounted by Franco against a club like Barcelona during his reign are proof that Madird never won a single trophy in the pre-80′s era through fair means. Heck, even Stefano was blackmailed into joining Madrid by Franco’s regimen, whereas his intended destination was Barcelona.

    By contrast, United have been victims of tragedies like the WWII bombings on Old Trafford (due to which the club had to rent neighbours, City’s, ground for the better part of a decade), the Munich air disaster, where the club not only lost it’s finest generation of players, most of them younger than 25, but also all the hardwork put in by the great Sir Matt during the 40s and 50s. The fact that United rebuilt within the short span of a decade to return to European supremacy is a credit to the spirit of the club. Even as early as the first decade of the 1900s United, then Newton Heath, faught banksupcy and returned in the famous red and white of United to go on and win the first FA Cup ever.
    The latest tragedy to have befallen on the great club, codename: Glazer, is one which’s effects you almost never see in the football because of the great Sir Alex. Any other manager would never have seen 3 back to back league titles, a Champions League crown, and countless other domestic titles in a period where the club has been drained of all it’s wealth by a greedy bunch with no heart.
    Inspite of not reinvesting a majority of the 80 million pounds gained by selling the best player in the world (who was literally made at Carrington) United managed to run the free spending Chelsea close.

    The fact of the matter is, Madrid will always be known as the playground of superstars, but home is where the heart is, and Madrid will never compare to this:
    United, home to- Ronaldo, Beckham, Giggs, Scholes, Best, Charlton, Meredith, et al.
    Madrid, home to- err… Raul?!

  5. Madrid are the bigger team in all but 2 areas. Money, whilst Madrid may show up with more profit, this is hugely distorted by the United debt payments. Secondly support, world wide Manchester United support is the largest. After that though, Real Madrid are the biggest club in every aspect.

  6. To dismiss Manchester United’s claims for being the biggest team in the World is to be ignorant of all the facts. Real Madrid is a team the has forged it’s history in a ‘Scottish’ type league with no real contenders outside of Barcelona, and through a sequence of wins in the old European Cup that hides the fact that the teams involved at that very early point in the competitions history were not actually the big teams of Europe.

    Add to this the unbelievableb ‘bank rolling’ Real Madrid has enjoyed -and still does – and we start to see a club based on all the wrong foundations.

    Manchester on the other hand ticks all the right boxes, other than the remarkable events that saw a group of American shopping mal dealers able to take over what at that time was the Worlds biggest and richest club on the strength of a very expensive IOU.

    Manchester has the biggest support throughout the World – not just Asia . It also has a fantastic record of achievements throughout it’s history and it’s recent successes come from good management at both senior and youth level.

    It operates in the most competative major league in the World -always has been – and until recent events has always traded as one of the richest, if not the richest Club in the World.

    Manchester United’s complete value, that includes all it’s assets and the value of it’s brand, is the highest of any football club in the World. Enough said.

    Real Madrid has had some great teams just as United has, but a look under the veneer of it’s success shows a team operating within a very corrupt environment, that has historicaly given it huge and unfair advantages over it’s domestic rivals, and a team that struggles to measure up to other teams in the modern era – both in terms of success on the field and general management of the club.

    Of course, the Spanish sun and shit loads of loaned money thrown at other clubs and players will always make ripples in the media and world of professional sport, but clubs like AC Milan, Juventus, Inter MIlan, Bayern Munich, Liverpool, Ajax and now Barcelona – their success in the periods they have been dominant and the way that success has been achieves makes them far better contenders for United’s deserved crown as the Worlds biggest football club, in terms of achievements at least, than Madrid’s ‘false’ golden period.

    As said above, taking everything into account the actual biggest club in terms of total value and support and in terms of it’s domestic and European/World success, having factored in the competiveness of domestic compeetition and the 6 European ‘wins’ Madrid enjoyed without any setup involving the major teams of Europe, is the Mighty Reds from Old Trafford – regardless of who Ranaldo’s mum wants to support!

    Now we just need a spot of Global Warming in the Salford area of Manchester and a slightly more attractive tax rate for the hard earned dosh that the more ‘mercenary’ players – and their mums and doting wives – place great weight on and Real Madrid will be well and truly condemmed to the list of Football has-beens.

    No attempt at getting the banks of Spain to buy the Worlds most expensive flops will ever raise Madrid to the summit of the football world. They have tried this approach throughout their history but it just doesn’t hold up to scrutiny.

  7. I wont say realmadrid won trophies they bought it …their academy speaks for itself if u look for the last decade..clearly barca and arsenal are in elite position.

  8. I think you will find Manachester United is not only the biggest football club, but also the biggest/Valuable sporting club in the world – See link below . And im a Liverpool supporter!

    http://www.forbes.com/lists/2010/34/soccer-10_Soccer-Team-Valuations_Rank.html

  9. Man U is as big as real. Anyone who says they’re not is in denial. Sure: real perhaps has an even greater history than united but nowadays united has been more successful. Plus they play in the world’s best league. I’m from the states and here utd is by far the bigger club.

  10. By all standards and any criteria you want to use to compare both clubs, Madrid is a bigger club of the two. Madrid has won more trophies, spend more money on players and has always signed the best players in world football and even I believe they have bigger followership than united. I am an ardent Manchester united fan but without contadiction madrid is bigger than our darling team

  11. United are big but madrid won the best club of 20th century. Fact

  12. Real Madrid are # 1 without a shadow of a doubt and Manchester United are a distant second. However, I’m sure if United had banks giving them unlimited non-repayable loans, they would also be able to spend over €220 every summer like Real Madrid. Face it, Real would be nowhere they are today without all that free money they’re getting and since they won 5 European Cups in a row when it nobody else cared about it. They were more concerned with their respective domestic leagues. The 5 cups back then today prove to be a massive achievement since they’ve now won 9 in total but those first 5 were not at all prestigious.

  13. real are not the best how can a team which cannot go further from the 1/16th stage of the champions league for 7 years say they are the best united all the way

  14. i am a rm fan.i got to say rm are the biggest club but man united are right behind em.

  15. Comment by: oladimeji oladapo 14/07/2010 @ 09:38

    “By all standards and any criteria you want to use to compare both clubs, Madrid is a bigger club of the two. Madrid has won more trophies, spend more money on players and has always signed the best players in world football and even I believe they have bigger followership than united.”
    —————————————————–
    Any Criteria? How about valuation (see John’s link to Forbes above)? Utd’s valuation is 28% greater than Real’s and that’s the first measurement you’d look to if comparing successful businesses. Or try operating profit if you like….Utd win on that too.

    You’re observation on fanbase is nonsense too. Utd have far bigger followings in Asia and Africa, in fact everywhere in the world you’ll find far more Utd shirts that Real Madrid.

    And do you seriously believe that ‘spending more money’ is a valid criteria? That realtes to your first word ‘standards’. Real Madrid don’t have any and the club operates with no morals whatsoever……should that be a criteria?

    As for trophies? You can’t compare as the Spanish league has been, by a distance, less competitive down the years and of course Real Madrid have been bank rolled by the government all the way.

    Had the Munich Air Disaster not happened in 1958 Utd would have had a team that would have won European Cups in the years that followed, at the same time depriving Madrid of some of their haul.

    So in terms of your “by all standards and criteria” proclamation…….how do ya like them apples???????

  16. Comment by: MK Fan 14/07/2010 @ 10:46

    “United are big but madrid won the best club of 20th century. Fact”

    ——————————————————-
    Definition of Big:
    ‘Of considerable size, number, quantity, magnitude, or extent; large.’

    Biggest: Superlative form of big.

    Definition of Best: ‘the thing that is most outstanding or excellent; something that tops all others.’

    now wait for it…………………there it is……….the penny has just dropped! (hopefully).

    …..and we’re 10 years on from the last century….and Real only got the award because of their European Cup record which of course was down to the 5 they won in the early years when it was a poor competition.

  17. Criteria that I would consider appropriate to rate clubs as being the biggest…

    Contribution to football over time: Real Madrid easily wins this one.

    Trophies: Real Madrid: 9 Champions League titles + 31 La Liga titles + 2 UEFA Cups = 42 major trophies. United: 3 Champions League titles + 18 EPL titles = 21 major trophies.

    Presence of past football greats: Real Madrid = Di Stefano, Puskas, Gento, Raymond Kopa, etc, etc, etc,etc, etc, Butragueno, Redondo, Figo, Zidane, Ronaldo, Raul. Manchester United = Bobby Charlton, George Best, Peter Schmeichel, Beckham, Giggs. Err, who else? I think I’m doing Beckham a favor by talking about him in the same category as these other names because he was a star born out of marketing.

    Opinion of players: It seems like the majority of all actual football players, (barring English players and fans on English speaking forums who have mostly only been exposed to the EPL), would prefer to play for Real Madrid over Manchester United. Just ask a certain Mr. Cristiano Ronaldo.

    Fanbase: I would say that the fanbases of both clubs are about equal. There is no way of knowing this statistic for certain. Obviously, with United’s marketing gurus at work and with Asian TV mostly showing only EPL matches, they have established a stronghold in Asia. However, despite this stronghold, Madrid continues to earn more revenue from commercial activity than United does. Makes you wonder where the real fans are, doesn’t it?

    Revenue: Real Madrid: 401m Euros. Manchester United: 327m Euros.

    Club youth system: I’m not even going to get into this one because I know that EPL biased people are unaware of how large Madrid’s system is. All I’m going to say is that there are more footballers that have come out of Real Madrid’s youth system who are playing football in Europe than from any other club in Europe.

    Most of the information that I have stated above are facts which can be verified with a little bit of research.

    I would like to conclude this email by saying that my listing out of these facts is not meant to slur or tarnish Manchester United. It is a great club in it’s own right which has achieved an admirable amount of success in the last 20 years, since the formation of the Premier League. It deserves plenty of accolades for what it is achieving on an off the pitch. However, what I do want is for you to give Real Madrid it’s proper due as the #1 club in Europe. To not do so would be to tarnish the history and reputations of every great footballer who has been connected with Madrid and who has helped shaped football into the game we love today.

    ————

    To BD Condell: Those are not apples. FYI, Forbes’ valuation is an “opinion”. A valuation is an estimate of a price that a buyer would have to pay in order to take ownership of an asset. Manchester United is a club that can be bought and sold because it is owned by an investor. Real Madrid is not a club that can be bought and sold because it is owned by its socios/members. Rather than looking at “valuations”, I’d suggest looking at the cold hard facts in annual revenue earned by each club.

  18. I think Real Madrid are the undisputed #1 club. After Madrid, it becomes harder to separate certain groups of club when taking into account the past and the present. So, here’s how I’d rank them:

    1st: Real Madrid
    Joint 2nd: Manchester United and Barcelona
    Joint 4th: AC Milan, Bayern Munich & Juventus
    Joint 7th: Arsenal, Inter Milan & Liverpool

  19. Anyone who honestly believes that Man United are as big as Real Madrid, never mind bigger, is a deluded idiot who should stop watching football immediately.

    United have had some great players down the years, but their list of honour can’t even compare to the likes of Di Stefano, Zidane, Raul, Ronaldo, Figo, Gento, Puskas, Butragueno etc.

    It’s arguable that Barcelona and AC Milan are also bigger clubs than United. I realise that many United fans are myopic idiots who only support them for the glory and the false belief that they’re the world’s biggest club because they have benefited from the Sky Sports era, but they’ll just have to accept they pale in comparison to Real Madrid.

    I mean, for fuck sake, a large portion of United’s popularity is playing the sympathy card for the Munich air crash, classless club. Real Madrid are not the most classy club either given Franco’s era, and what Perez is doing now, but they’re a bigger club than United in almost every barometer.

    Anyone who can’t see that or refuses to admit it, well, please just give up football. You’ve probably only been watching since 1992 at the very earliest anyway.

  20. ‘By contrast, United have been victims of tragedies like the WWII bombings on Old Trafford (due to which the club had to rent neighbours, City’s, ground for the better part of a decade), the Munich air disaster, where the club not only lost it’s finest generation of players, most of them younger than 25, but also all the hardwork put in by the great Sir Matt during the 40s and 50s. The fact that United rebuilt within the short span of a decade to return to European supremacy is a credit to the spirit of the club. Even as early as the first decade of the 1900s United, then Newton Heath, faught banksupcy and returned in the famous red and white of United to go on and win the first FA Cup ever.
    The latest tragedy to have befallen on the great club, codename: Glazer, is one which’s effects you almost never see in the football because of the great Sir Alex. Any other manager would never have seen 3 back to back league titles, a Champions League crown, and countless other domestic titles in a period where the club has been drained of all it’s wealth by a greedy bunch with no heart.
    Inspite of not reinvesting a majority of the 80 million pounds gained by selling the best player in the world (who was literally made at Carrington) United managed to run the free spending Chelsea close.

    The fact of the matter is, Madrid will always be known as the playground of superstars, but home is where the heart is, and Madrid will never compare to this:
    United, home to- Ronaldo, Beckham, Giggs, Scholes, Best, Charlton, Meredith, et al.
    Madrid, home to- err… Raul?!’

    Apart from the entire first paragraph I have posted being sentimental bullshit propaganda designed to paint United in a favourable light, your sickening attack on Raul is clueless. Beckham couldn’t lace Raul’s boots. Giggs has never been as good either, although Scholes can claim to be.

    Next you will tell me that Giggs has showed longevity over 20 years, despite the fact that Until very recently the Premiership (the same league which United has won most of its titles over the last 20 years) was comfortably the third best league in Europe, whilst Raul was scoring goals galore in the CL and La Liga (first club to have two teams play in the CL Final, took the PL 8 years to emulate said feat, which was also long after Serie A did).

    I mean United hold fucking Cantona up as a legend of their greatest era ever, Cantona! A guy who was never world-class and could never have licked Zidane’s left toe. Although I am not surprised that many United fans have claimed he was better (lol).

    LOL at denigrating Raul and glorifying Beckham. I think bowls might be more your thing. Do you even live in Manchester?

  21. ‘Had the Munich Air Disaster not happened in 1958 Utd would have had a team that would have won European Cups in the years that followed, at the same time depriving Madrid of some of their haul.’

    Man United fans are so desperate they have sank into pure speculation and attempts at guessing what might and might not have happened to further their agenda. What losers.

    I could also say that without Sky Sports making you their darling you would never have caught Liverpool in league titles, but I don’t have to as anyone with any respect for European football and its history, rather than merely English football, knows Real blow United out of the water. Regardless of what insipid, deluded United fans believe.

    And for the record, I prefer Barcelona to Real. But I won’t lie.

  22. @Ramos: “Most of the information that I have stated above are facts which can be verified with a little bit of research.”

    You need a lesson in what a fact actually is.

    “Presence of past football greats” is not factual it’s opinion. Either through ignorance or because it suits you, you ignore many Utd names: Taylor, Edwards, Law, Robson, McGrath, Keane, Scholes….I could go on….and Utd developed Ronaldo by the way.

    “Opinion of players: It seems like the majority of all actual football players, (barring English players and fans on English speaking forums who have mostly only been exposed to the EPL), would prefer to play for Real Madrid over Manchester United. Just ask a certain Mr. Cristiano Ronaldo.”

    Again not a fact, an opinion and bullshit at that! Ronaldo = majority????

    “Club youth system….” Produce the evidence if you want to count this as a fact. Of course you can’t…..because, again….it is bullshit!

    The trophy count is a fact (at last….we found one!) but is not comparable because of the relative competitiveness of the 2 Leagues and in any event is something to be used in a “best” not “biggest” debate.

    And Revenue is also a fact…..but take the TV revenues from Real (and Barcelona) and they are beolw Utd in revenue terms. In other words the 2 big Spanish teams selfishly negotiate their own TV deals and let the rest rot, while in England the TV revenues are shared with the more successful clubs getting the bigger share. Also Utd win on operating profit…..which is much important in the valuation model.

    You call fanbase equal because it suits you not to lose that one……but granted, it cannot be measured accurately.

    And finally, your last statement is utter nonsense! Forbes is a highly respected international publication and significant research goes into their list compilations. Valuation can vary somewhat depending on what weighting is given to different variables etc. but to say that the Forbes valuation is just opinion is rubbish.

    This is the single most fundamental measure of size and Utd win it hands down……which is why you are trying to wriggle out of it.

    “Real Madrid is not a club that can be bought and sold because it is owned by its socios/members.”

    The last gasp from a drowning man that. Anything can be valued regardless of whether it will/can be sold.

    “Rather than looking at “valuations”, I’d suggest looking at the cold hard facts in annual revenue earned by each club.”

    Laughable! Of course you’d say that….as it suits your position but does not stand-up to cross-examination. We are talking about financial size here…..and any financial analyst would dismiss you out of hand on that one.

    So, in summary, you confuse opinion with fact and you ignore what suits your needs. Forbes have just published a Top 50 Richest Teams list this week and Utd sit top of the list with Real in 6th place.

    But I guess that’s all fantasy, conjecture and opinion…..because it doesn’t support your (fabricated) case!

  23. Comment by: Hahaha 23/07/2010 @ 03:52

    “Anyone who honestly believes that Man United are as big as Real Madrid, never mind bigger, is a deluded idiot who should stop watching football immediately.”

    Let me point out one thing to you up-front. When you open a post with a statement like that you leave the readers in little doubt as to who the “deluded idiot” is.

    Both parties in this debate have suggested criteria for assessing who is the ‘biggest’ club and of course there is disagreement on some of those points……that’s the essence of debate.

    You, on the other hand, offer nothing but bitter diatribe to ‘substantiate’ your little rant. Try breaking it down, try coming up with reasonable, logical argument. Hell…….take a few night classes or read a book.

    But do something to improve yourself before coming back-on here and embarassing yourself further.

    Now assuming you have taken my advice let’s start here:

    1. Go to the Forbes link of the Worlds Top 50 richest clubs.
    2. Absorb that and construct some arguments for or against.
    3. Consider other aspects to the debate that are relevant and consider your view on those.
    4. Carefully read the inputs above from other participants in this debate and determine your position regarding the points made.
    5. Return with a posting that is constructed out of logical thinking and present a cohesive and rational point of view.
    6.Change your name as it instantly suggests that you are an idiot.
    7. Read my post above and try to clear your mind as to what the difference between fact and opinion is……I know it’s hard but with instruction you’ll start to understand (hopefully).

    You will be amazed that people may actually respond to your points (whether they agree or not doesn’t really matter).

    I look forward to your next post……..but I won’t hold my breath! :)

  24. I’m a United fan but I still feel that Real Madrid is the biggest club in the world.Why?

    -Because of the number of trophies they have won.The huge difference in the number of European Cups won proves this.

    -Because their history is much greater and bigger.This is not to say that United’s history and traditions are poor but there was a reason why FIFA awarded Real as the best club of the century and not United,despite winning the treble in 99.

  25. BD Condell – I have given plenty of reasons why Real Madrid are a bigger club than Manchester United, Most neutrals will agree with me.

    Manchester United is the club with the most moronic fans I have ever spoken to. They try and tell me that Cantona was better than Zidane, Best better than Pele, that they have the best squad in Europe etc. They mcked me for saying Barcelona and Bayern Munich 2009 and 2010 respectively would eliminate our club from the CL. And what happened/. And that’s just over the last two years.

    I understand that you’re a Man Unied fan who can’t beat the truth, but I have given numerous reasons why Real ar the bigger club, which you would see if you didn’t deflect onto my aggressive nature. Better players throughout history, more decorated, and colinal links and fans in Latin America where football is the number one sport rather than Asia where it’s just a casual pastime.

    The fact that most non-UK based players elect to join Real over United backs me up too. Or are you claiming you know more about the game than active footballers?

    It is plainly ludcirous to think Man United are a bigger club than Real Madrid, and I agree with everything the creator of this thread has said.

    Man United fans are so offensive with pushing their club to astronomical heights and you clowns are no different.

    Thinking United are bigger than real Madrid demonstrates a real lack of knowledge of European football.

    Feel free to keep deluding yourself or reply in a condescending manner – won’t change that most players and people in the game (those who really matter) know who the bigger club is.

  26. Oh, and one more thing BD, don’t be fooled by my vicious assaults. Judging a person by one post which they made when they were very angry indicates who the real fool is here…

    I sata supervised MENSA exam and scored in the top 8 percentile of the country. I also had three undonditional university accounting offers and am well on my way to obtaining a degree.

    Does this necessarily make me extremely intelligent? No, but what it does do is prove that I am not an idiot, as an idiot cannot attain said achievements.

    Be careful what you wish for, because if I decide to find a cool head (in case you hadn’t noticed my plan was to antagonise the likes of you) I will destroy every argument you put forward, like I have done to many United fans in the past.

    Also, you can see very clearly that my claims for Real being the bigger club draw parallels with the original poster, so why select the opening part of my original post and ignore the other parts where I back up my stance? It seems to be a very common thing on the internet, to zone in on an assault someone makes and ignore their more salient points.

    Let’s assume I had been very polite and respectful. You would have been forced to address my points, and you know that when I claim Real have had historically better players, are bigger in nations where football is the main sport, are more decorated, and are preferred to United by most non-UK active players today (including your very own ex-player Ronaldo) you can’t really retort with anything substantial to refute these very genuine claims. Can you?

  27. One more thing – apologies for the numerous typos above. I get very flustered when I ‘go off on one’ and I don’t bother proof-reading.

  28. Why do you keep mentioning money? Money is not the defining factor in how big a club is. Besides, United are crippled with debt. Are you an economist? You should read Why England Lose.

    I am not surprised that a fan of the corporate monster than is Manchester United would place such value on finances however, over prestige, history and historical player lists.

    Finally, please read my other points which you conveniently neglected which are backed up by evidence, where I speak about he Munich air crash, how for most of Ferguson’s tenure (86-2004 certainly) the PL was the third-best league in Europe at best (arguably is now number one) and therefore was easier to win.

    And also, please denigrate the lad who cast aspersions upon the legend that is Raul. I might have been aggressive but he was just plain insulting.

  29. By the way, if you are going to arrogantly ask students to ‘get to night class’, you should probably learn the difference between ‘your’ and ‘you’re’:

    ‘You’re observation on fanbase is nonsense too. Utd have far bigger followings in Asia and Africa, in fact everywhere in the world you’ll find far more Utd shirts that Real Madrid.’

    For the record, all this point says is United are much more strategically marketed, more of a business. Football is about so much more than that. Why would you actually be proud to have Asian and African glory-hunters? That’s a superficial way of measuring the size of any club.

    Don’t you think that, for instance, Barcelona’s struggles in the Franco era and what the club means to Catalonia (mes que un club) holds far more sentiment and significance , resonates more than the fact that you have a lot of glory-hunters in Asia who treat Old Trafford like a tourist centre and take photos of Gerrard when Liverpool score against your team?

  30. ‘Forbes have just published a Top 50 Richest Teams list this week and Utd sit top of the list with Real in 6th place.

    So you would support any list which would place Real as the 6th best club in the world by any criteria? Don’t you see such a list isn’t worth its salt and there is far more to the game than finances?

    Also, I like how you’re attempting to claim this is a matter of opinion yet you arrogantly attack any of Ramos’ points which suggest Real is the bigger club.

    Sorry for the multi-posting but I just find more inconsistency every time I look over your posts. If you endorse any list which would claim Real Madrid are the 6th best club in Europe in any respect then you need to take a look in the mirror.

    I don’t even like Real, but you are so biased it’s incredible. Where’s the objectivity?

  31. ‘“Presence of past football greats” is not factual it’s opinion. Either through ignorance or because it suits you, you ignore many Utd names: Taylor, Edwards, Law, Robson, McGrath, Keane, Scholes….I could go on….and Utd developed Ronaldo by the way.

    Excellent players, but you can’t seriously be putting them up with Zidane, gento, Puskas, Di Stefano, Raul etc can you? Even Best and Charlton, your two biggest legends, are not of the level of Alfredo Di Stefano or Zidane, certainly not in terms of worldwide acclaim. Best isn’t that acclaimed outside of the UK. I am sure you will tell me that’s not correct though, living in your United bubble.

    And I think you will find Sporting Lisbon developed Ronaldo. He joined United at 18 (and Gary neville had to recommend him to Ferguson). True that he became world-class at United but a lrage part of his education was at Sporting’s academy, which is one of the most famed in Europe (I doubt you know that). Do some research on Academia Sporting for a list of fantastic players they have brought through – including many of Portugal’s 90s ‘golden generation’. Why do you skew the facts? Why can’t you be fair to other clubs? That arrogance and dismissiveness is precisely what I detest about United fans.

  32. ‘Had the Munich Air Disaster not happened in 1958 Utd would have had a team that would have won European Cups in the years that followed, at the same time depriving Madrid of some of their haul.’

    Again, how you have the fucking AUDACITY to attack me when your argument is based on rewriting the past is sickening. You don’t know for sure that the Busby Babes would have won anything. They were very talented but there are no guarantees. Your arguments are very weak it must be said. But you’re too biased to realise.

  33. Ramos’ reply to you utterly destroyed you, yet you still argue on like a whimpering neanderthal.

  34. Here’s a little quote from last summer which I just read. Enjoy:

    ‘Of course they are, Wrighty7. Manure fans have always deluded themselves about being the biggest club in Europe. What a load of bollocks, they are not even the biggest club in England let alone Europe. You have to thank those disgusting cunts on Sky Sports who have spoon fed this nonsense to all the children and new “footy” fans. I fucking hate that word, it’s football you muppets. Anyway, sorry about the swearing and I leave you with this observation: When that ganster turned up at that mickey mouse club in Fulham and gave Arsenal a blank cheque for Henry and Paddy, who were in their prime, did we sell. No way. Face it Manure, you have lost one of your greatest ever players, in his prime, to a far bigger and classier club in a far bigger and classier city. Those are the facts which you must now live with… ‘

  35. My final point is, I know Man United fans themselves, the smarter ones, who are arguing right now that Real are the biggest club in the world.

    Just accept defeat for fuck sake.

  36. Just reading this list, the amount of times I have laughed with the statements that real madrid is better and bigger due to the players and trophies they have won and had is absurd. Firstly, yes, in terms of history and players real madrid are better considering they have won 9 champions leagues and 31 la ligas and man u have won 3 champions league and 18 epls. Madrid won the first 5 champions leagues and have played in a league that is virtually them and barca all the time with an occasional la liga winner of valencia, sevilla or atletico madrid. Whilst man u have played in a league that in the past 50 yrs has been them, chelsea, liverpool, arsenal, everton, tottenham, nottingham forest and leeds united. When talking about players, madrid brings up hardly any other than raul and casillas and will just buy big stars from clubs like man u (beckham, van nistelrooy and cr9), man u will bring up stars like charlton, best, edwards, giggs, beckham, scholes or buy them young before they are stars and make them into one like law, ronaldo, rooney and keane.

    But nearly everyone hasn’t answered the question correctly, the question asks who is bigger not better and by the way man u in the past 20 yrs have been better. Bigger goes by the amount of money they have and their total popularity. Outside of Spain, the only region on this planet that has more madrid fans than man u ones would be portugal and south america, whilst north america, africa, asia and oceania where i live (Australia) has more man u fans. I mean in Australia 80% of football fans like man u followed by liverpool, arsenal, chelsea then madrid. Man u is in the most watched sporting league in the world (epl), which ofcourse helps. In the past 10yrs forbes has constantly recorded the worlds richest “sporting” clubs with man u constantly first with a value of $1.83 billion and a record of 333 million fans and 139 million hardcore fans, which is according to forbes the most in the world. Real Madrid is 6th on the list with the yankees and some NFL clubs between 1st and 6th. It says Madrid gets the most revenue in the world with like $539 million to Man U’s $413 million but according to it, Man U makes more profit because they spend less. I mean any club would make the amount that madrid makes a year if they bought kaka, cr9, zidane, ronaldo and figo. I mean shit that’d be a lot of shirt sales. Also by way the Madrid has 54% debt whilst Man u have 36%. That also was on forbes in like April, go look it up. Also to the guy, that said Forbes is biased is full of shit, i mean why would they put a football club like man u ahead of their precious NFL teams.

    http://www.forbes.com/2010/07/20/most-valuable-athletes-and-teams-business-sports-sportsmoney-fifty-fifty-teams_slide_25.html