Premier League coming to the US?
On Friday the BBC ran a story about the possibility of Premier League games being played in the US – mostly thanks to a soundbite from West Ham (non-executive) chairman Eggert Magnusson and another quote from Arsenal shareholder Stan Kroenke.
I’d like to hear your views on the subject – whether such an event (even a one-off) would be good or bad for the clubs involved and the promotion of football in the US. I was talking about this with the Red Ranter yesterday and we decided to do a debate, arguing for and against the idea (with me basically playing devil’s advocate), and then putting it up to you, the readers, for comments.
So please read both the for and against arguments below and then let us know why you think it’s a good / crap idea.
Playing Premier League matches in the US is stupid and hurts the game
Red Ranter argues against the idea of playing Premier League matches in the US.
This Sunday, a landmark event happens for football fans. I am, of course, talking about American football (NFL) here. This Sunday, fans will queue up outside Wembley to watch the Miami Dolphins take on New York Giants — in a proper NFL game. Disappointments have been expressed by respective fans in the US about such a thing happening. As this article on Timesonline quotes,
However, reactions in Miami have been less favourable, and not only from Dolphins fans, who will lose one of only eight guaranteed home games next season; South Florida’s large community of exiled New Yorkers had been looking forward to a rare visit from the Giants. Although the Dolphins and the New York Jets are divisional rivals and play each other home and away every season, the Dolphins and the Giants play in different conferences and have met in Florida in regular-season games only twice, in 1993 and 1996.
“I’m sure this is great for London, but it absolutely sucks for us Giants fans in Miami,” a contributor to a Giants fan website wrote. “I live two miles from Dolphin Stadium and I’ve been looking forward to going to this game and I’m telling you this would’ve been like a home game for the Giants. I agree with the concept of expanding the NFL, but this was the wrong game. New York-Miami rivalry is the best there is.”
Quite.
Honestly, though, living in the US has taught me certain things about sport here that differ from that in England (or anywhere in Europe for that matter). For one, the fan following in the US may not evoke the kind of emotions football (soccer — from here on I will call it soccer to distinguish it from NFL) brings out from fans. We all know how fiercely fought contests the Merseyside derby or the North London derby games are fought. Not just among players, but also rival fans. In Italy, fan violence, although bad in general, is an integral part of the whole atmosphere that builds up into contests.
To be fair to the Americans, they have their share of rivalries. In baseball, you have the Red Sox and the Yankees — extremely fierce rivals. And you have similar stuff in the other American sports. But most clubs in the US are franchises; shops that are set up by single owners who sell entertainment to the paying public. And just like other businesses, they do shut up shop and shift to a different part of the country. A recent instance was when Houston Oilers jumped over to Tennessee and rechristened themselves as Tennessee Titans. Nice feeling if you are a fan living in Houston, watching the Oilers every season, no? How would it feel for a Gooner, for instance, to see his club shut up shop and move to umm, I don’t know, off the top of my head… Manchester, and change its name to FC Manchester or something like that?
But that’s not what we are talking about are we? We are talking about stealing a prospective home/away fixture for a team whose fans visit the club for years, soak in the atmosphere of the stadium, where the players hear their fans yell out inspiring chants, egging their team on. While it is one thing increasing ticket prices and pricing out the regulars from the stadium. But it takes snatching the game away from the fans to a whole different level if you deprive them of a game that they look forward to with great interest. Let’s face it, the Premier League wouldn’t move Arsenal vs Derby to the US, if they wanted to. They would rather move Arsenal vs Manchester United or something like that — thus leaving expectant fans out in the lurch.
The Premier League is what it is not just because of Sky or lucrative sponsorship deals. It is what it is because of the fan base of the clubs that have grown organically over long periods of history. It is the reason why, despite the huge number of clubs that dot the country, a surprisingly small number of them have only gone bust. You will still see fans in the terraces of smaller clubs, be it Grimsby Town or Coventry City. Soccer fans in Europe are unconditionally loyal to their clubs through thick and thin, and it would be an enormous disservice if their heart and soul is ripped out of them and planted in a different country. Be it the US, or even Ireland.
The real passion shown by fans in American sports is sadly not in Professional, but in College football (which is very commercial otherwise. It is beamed on national networks and sports channels like ESPN). Generations of alumni travel miles to bring their grandsons to games of their alma mater. Ask such college football fans if they could accept moving their teams to some other distant state (leave alone country) to play college football and they would give you a stare like you’ve never seen before.
And that’s also why foreign ownership — with the likes of Eggert Magnussen, along with the new crop of American owners — worries me.
The Premier League is good as it is. It is the biggest soccer league in the world in terms of viewership and money. And as one Premiership spokesman, thankfully, said:
“I just don’t see it happening, with the way the league is structured – on a one-home, one-away basis – you would damage the integrity of the competition by fiddling with the dynamic of the League.”
Premier League clubs should play in the US
Surely any idea that aims to promote the Premier League and bring in more fans and revenue merits at least some consideration?
The willingness of US sports authorities to make the trip over the pond and have NFL teams play a competitive fixture stands in stark contrast to the conservative refusal of the Premier League to tamper with the current system. On the surface (and indeed, when you consider how it affects the fans) it’s a strong argument – why should you take two teams, leave their 70k fans behind (assuming that we’re shifting the Pool vs Man Utd from OT over to the US), put the players under unnecessary stress, all in the name of the not-so-mighty dollar?
We must move away from what Eggert Magnusson has said and look at it in a more realistic way.
You can’t play a league game in a different country. It’s retarded to the point of painting E Magnusson and Stan K as complete asshats. However, think of it in on a broader perspective – how could you bring the Premier League to the US without forcing the teams to play league games there and upset the fans (who are an integral part of the sport, no matter what you say)?
The first thing that comes to mind is to have several times make the trip over the pond to take part in a tournament, a mini-league of sorts, as part of their pre-season. Imagine Liverpool, Manchester United, West Ham and Everton spending 2 weeks in the US playing a tournament as part of their pre-season. In terms of increasing exposure in the US, this is perhaps the best thing second to improved TV coverage (which is nowhere near as good as US-based Premier League fans want it to be).
Preposterous? It requires some organisation and a willingness to cooperate, but in the long run this makes sense in terms of finances and – to be fair to other pre-season opposition – getting players in shape. Having your players go up against Premier League opposition in the pre-season may increase familiarity but there’s no substitute to Premier League opposition if you want your players to be ready for…wait for it…the Premier League.
The money from such a tournament, plus the exposure for the clubs and the Premier League in general, makes this a natural next step (as long as they can sort out the logistics). An Arsenal vs Manchester United game would generate more interest than a Liverpool vs Milan game.
League rivalries can be transfered across the pond, even if league matches cannot.
We shouldn’t reject the idea out of hand just because the actual suggestion is unreasonable. The general proposition – to increase Premier League exposure in the US – is still a valuable idea and something the Premier League management need to work on. Who knows, they might even sell the rights for showing those matches online to YouTube (wishful thinking).
And while we’re at it, such a tournament would be a great idea to try out the cheerleaders in football concept.
Now that you’ve heard both views, it’s time to share yours. Do you think the Premier League should play league matches in the US? Do you think it’s feasible to export Premier League rivalries to the US (considering what a good job US marketers do to build hype)?
Let us know in the comments.
Topics: English Premier League, Features, Help Football
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I don’t think that Premier League games should be playes in the US
October 28th, 2007 @ 00:56This is an interesting discussion. While I can see arguments for both sides, I would like to suggest an alternative. Since England has many Cup competitions, along with the Community Shield, why not play one of those (excluding the FA Cup) on US shores? I realize that supporters of the respective teams would be cheated out of a final; however, such games would be a good promotional vehicle in the States.
In August 1993, Torino and AC Milan played the Italian Super Cup at RFK Stadium in Washington. It was, to the best of my knowledge, the first competitive Italian fixture outside of Italy. The attendance was about 25,000, and both teams fielded their top eleven (Among them Enzo Francescoli and Giuseppe Galli for Torino, and Franco Baresi, Billy Costacurta, Roberto Donadoni, Paolo Maldini, and Dejan Savicevic for Milan).
With the number of American owners entering the Premiership, (whether wanted or not) I believe that it is inevitable to see more appearances in the USA. Chelsea has been going to LA for a few years of pre-season training, and has built a training facility there. No doubt the Glazers would want an annual game in the Tampa Bay Area for Man U. The same for Tom Hicks with Liverpool in Texas. I believe that Aston Villa had a summer tour in North America last year.
There used to be a World Series of Soccer summer tournament that was similar to the competition that Ahmed discussed. It was run by former Lazio and New York Cosmos star, Giorgio Chinaglia, who now hosts a show about the EPL, and specifically Chelsea, on Sirius Satellite Radio.
Obviously, competitive fixtures would be a more delicate issue.
October 28th, 2007 @ 00:56Nah theres no way this could happen.i think its a terrible idea.playing games away from england?like fergie or wenger will allow their teams to move thousands of miles to play A game and then travel back.if usa fans dont like football i dont think anything will change it.imo
October 28th, 2007 @ 02:29Aaawww why not play United v ‘Pool in Ireland
. seriously though, unless I move to America in the near future, which doesn’t seem likely to happen, I will be be against this idea ’til the end. Although a mini-tournament wouldn’t be bad. If you got one top 4 side every year, and then 3 mid-table teams it would increase the mid-table teams’ exposure while still giving American fans a good quality game to watch. Maybe throw in a few American teams to help get supporters into the stadium.
October 28th, 2007 @ 02:53As an American – I think the EPL should play in England except during friendlies with MLS teams. I like watch and follow EPL but don’t want the EPL here. I also hope that UK don’t decide to take up NFL. I can understand it as a novelty to have an NFL game at Wembley but in my opinion NFL is boring. It’s a sport where you see a bunch of fat muscular players run in to each other. You see action for about 30 seconds then wait for 5 minutes while they reset. The average life expectancy for an NFL player is 52 years of age. Scripps Howard compared the mortality rates for professional-football players with the 2,403 Major League Baseball players who have died in the last century. The comparison found that football players are more than twice as likely to die before age 50.
October 28th, 2007 @ 02:53The average weight in the NFL has grown by 10 percent since 1985 to a current average of 248 pounds. The heaviest position, offensive tackle, went from 281 pounds two decades ago to 318 pounds. The Scripps Howard study used the body-mass index to determine whether a player was obese. The NFL has previously decried the standard for not distinguishing between muscle and fat. More than 500 players on NFL training-camp rosters last summer were listed as weighing more than 300 pounds, an exponential increase in the past two decades. Iowa State University researchers have concluded that one in 10 high school football players are severely obese. 28% were at risk of being overweight, 45% were overweight, 9% met adult standards for severe obesity.
No. Non. Nyet. Nada. Nein. Nahi.
So why limit it to Premier League? Why not export La Liga & Serie A? In fact why stop at the US? Why not get League matches to be played in the fastest growing/lucrative football fan market which is Asia?
This idea is bad on so many levels.
October 28th, 2007 @ 03:35So let me get this straight; the same people who have been berating David Beckham’s decision to move to the USA, particularly on the grounds of his air-miles (the impossibility of maintaining fitness whilst on international duty) now want regular matches to be played in another continent?
I agree with Spiral Architect – the idea is a non-starter.
And Ahmed – you have tried to paint an ideal picture, but your argument does not address the comments made. The comments were about Premier League matches being played abroad, something which should never happen. I’d rather see G17 (or G14, whatever they are now) set up a European super league.
October 28th, 2007 @ 03:43Regular season games – NO. As a season ticket holder @ Toronto FC, I would be absolutley livid if my team did that. Not to mention the effects of jet lag on the poor players, and the home and away advantage being uneven. Friendlies and Mini Tournaments – Definately. They have happened in New York and Philedelphia in the not so distant past. Manchester United, Barcelona, Juventus and AC Milan, have all played each other in the friendly games in the US preseason. I would also like to see MLS teams play more friendlies in other countries. This is a good step for the sport in all countires. This past summer, Aston Villa played Toronto FC in a preseason friendly. Maurice Edu shut ReoCoker down in the midfield and all of a sudden, Villa are expressing interest in him. Good for the sport here – exposure for our players, good for teams in other countries – finding hidden talent. I won’t even get started on the amount of money that would be involved for everyone.
October 28th, 2007 @ 04:22Hugo – there’s a reason for that: I think the basic idea (better exposure of the Premier League in the US) is something worth pursuing, so just because the first suggestion is unfeasible, it doesn’t mean we should reject everything out of hand.
October 28th, 2007 @ 05:03Ahmed you’re a complete retard. Sports in the USA are so commercialised. Why do you think there are timeouts in all of the big games in the US? Because thats where the ads come in(and with that the money). Why, even if it is for the sake of balance, do you try to support that notion? We’ll be having EPL matches with those pseudo american commentators and with timeouts next. One more reason why foreign investment should be stopped at all costs in the League………..
October 28th, 2007 @ 07:21I don’t like when the National Football league or the National Hockey League come over there to play games because it severely screws those teams up with the travel time, jet lag and the distractions. Why would I then wish that on the EPL or any soccer league for that matter.
In England their might be a curiosity to see big league US football or hockey, but I know in America that it’s not a big deal for anyone but the die hard fans that pay to go see the matches at big metropolitan cities that high European or South American ethnic populations. Delete them from the equation and only kids care. And they don’t have the dollars to make a difference.
October 28th, 2007 @ 07:44Ignadirshah – Not to sound defensive, but as far as I’m aware, every EPL player wears a tribute to his sponsor emblazoned across his chest. Isn’t there perhaps a whiff of commercialism there?
As an American, I’ve enjoyed the friendlies played by EPL sides on US soil. I found the MLS All-Star game this Summer vs Celtic highly entertaining. It’s great playing host to much stronger teams than the MLS can produce at this point. I’d be in favor of more friendlies featuring EPL teams, particularly those with MLS partnerships. I’d be very much in favor of a mini-tournament featuring EPL teams.
But I see no reason why regular-season EPL matches should be played anywhere other than England. I can certainly see why the Miami fans are upset.
And I’d be in favor of continued soccer (sorry) broadcasts commercial-free in the US, as they are now. With the commentators with the funny accents, you know.
October 28th, 2007 @ 07:58Really, this is amazingly disastrous what the US
October 28th, 2007 @ 08:27Ahmed, I understand you are only playing the devil’s advocate here. I am based out of Dallas, and I am nuts about Manchester United. While it would be great for me personally to see them play a competitive game in USA, it looks like a bad idea.
One, it places a huge stress on players to travel across the ocean to play a single game. What is to stop teams playing 20 out of 38 games (or whatever number) all over the world? It is the premier league, not a travelling circus!
Two, you begin to alienate the local fan base, and you’d agree with me that there is no support like the home support.
Third, the people who watch the games in USA will most likely be the ones who follow soccer in the first place. You might get a few new fans, but you’ll likely lose some frustrated ones as well. And I dont think you will find 75000 Manchester United fans in any place outside Manchester.
Fourth, how will the players take it? Prawn sandwich will seem like an innocuous comment.
Fifth, the team is called Manchester United (or Arsenal or whatever) for a reason.
That said, I fear that ecoonmics might rule and this turns out to be reality!
October 28th, 2007 @ 10:07Well let me start…
carling cup matches would be nice here not the semi-final or final as a american i realize this is englands game me im the sad story of a american who saw the world cup 06 and wanted more and started my journey claiming a club ARSENAL FC!!! and thinkin which league with which type of stlye suits me italian league bundesliga slow leagues la liga intermidiate passes and sum long passes with a attacking mentality not focused so much on defense barca,real madrid,sevilla fc valencia, i choosed england because the complexity the physical level is higher than any league in europe and cover most bases overall this is Englands game and we should respect that
October 28th, 2007 @ 11:34Bux, the sponsored jersies and kits are part of the “necessary evil”(s) of Football. The same goes for the “Reebok Stadium”, the “Emirates Stadium” and the various “Pepsi” logos you see around Old Trafford. If the point is to grow ‘Soccer’ in the US, let them support their own teams(aka the MLS). As someone who was in the US for a short time period(and will most probably return there in some time), I have to say that I tried my best to enjoy the games with NY RedBulls, Chicago Fire and the whole lot. While the standard of the games leave a lot to be desired, it was good to see some really passionate fans. But there is the resounding predictions that it will never reach the level of American football or Baseball or Basketball, why? Because the televisions revenues will never reach the same as the above sports. Why? Because of the continuous nature of the game. Why do you think cricket is so popular in India? Because of the huge tv revenues through ads. Coming back to the argument, i feel there is no need to bring the teams across the Atlantic. It is an insult to their loyal fans and also to the local soccer teams. If it is some pre season friendlies, its okay. On the other hand, if the fans are so dedicated to their clubs, let them take the time and effort to go to the home stadiums of their favourite teams and see(like I’m planning to do in the not too distant future)…………….
October 28th, 2007 @ 12:19ahmed…. this is a interesting idea, but even from the exposure point of view bringing a league game to the US is a BAD IDEA….. let me elaborate
i’ve been living here fr the last 2 years, and its clear to me that a large chunk of the public doesnt even know man u (trust me, i know…. i have a poster of a crest in my room, and everytime someone comes to my room, i have to tell them about it!!!)
i guess if teams come here for their pre-seasons ppl will come to know about them… BUT remember, pre-season comes at the time of the year when the NBA and NFL are closed and the MLB is stagnant and yet the US basketball team playing puerto rico creats more of a buzz than soccer!!! late Aug to end of sept is baseball time (with the push for playoff spots) and Oct has the World Series… then till jan end we have the NFL (the business end of the season, from games 8-16 in the regular season, then the playoffs and then the SUPER BOWL) come feb there’s the NBA all-star weekend and then we have the march madness (college basketball.. oh yeah its big here!!) and then the climax of the NCAA college football season (the rose bowl etc.) and then from end of april to end of june there are the NBA playoffs followed by the NBA finals….
and when the yanks arent watching these games, they’re day-dreaming about them!!
seriously dude, i really dont see soccer competing with any of these sports, simply coz baseball, football and basketball are american sports and soccer is always gonna be 4th… so lets not take games away from the public that actually cares about the clubs (in Englan) and play them in stadiums with a bunch some girls who think they’ll get to see David Beckham and some guys who’re either there to see the girls or who couldnt get tickets to the games they really wanted to see….. or both!!!
October 28th, 2007 @ 13:18nope sorry, dont get why their playing nfl on our turf, they should stay in the u.s, i can understand tours but not league matches, and the premier league shouldnt be played their either, thats robbing us of our heritage and rights, and ts a complete waste of money since your only going to get half the fans then you would get in england, heck, before beckham came to galaxy ther was a survey seeing how many people new him, only a handfull, some guy thought he wasthe king of england!.
October 28th, 2007 @ 14:05I just don’t know but I am leaning towards it being a bust. Asia though is another story be/c of the brand power the EPL already has there. It just is lacking here – both the team recognition and the sport familiarity. Then again, the only way to up the brand recognition of both the sports and the league would probably be done, most effectively, by bringing it to their doorstep. But without the atmosphere of the games as they are in the UK, I am not sure if it’d be the same or if it’d be worth it – and wouldn’t the Brits be pretty damn pissed off too? When Chelsea has come over these past few years, I don’t remember seeing any coverage in mainstream, non sport media and I don’t recall any non soccer fans knowing or caring. While I would love it, its might just not be feasible. I think it would put those teams at a disadvantage in league play as well as making that trip to the States is not really the best for athlete’s bodies.
ps) There are already some cheerleaders in football – I know Chivas USA has got something of the sort and doesn’t the Mexican league as well?
October 29th, 2007 @ 01:24I was against the NFL going to London. I’m sure it is great exposure, and the English fans loved it. But not a game that means something. Play preseason warm up games in other countries, not the games that matter. That was a bad idea for the NFL and will be a bad idea for Premiership. As much as I’d love to see England’s top teams play each other here, it’s just not feasible. Great concept, horrible idea.
October 29th, 2007 @ 20:14The US fan is far more of a watch-the-game-on-TV fan than the average Brit or European. Why? Population density, and per-capita # of teams.
So if the goal is to expand the brand into the US market, start giving pushing it in the medium that the US viewer is most willing to receive it: open up the wires!!!
We get a handful of Prem games here in the states, and very often is a Boro-Reading tie or something similarly unappealing. Here, we’re used to seeing every game if we want it…there’re almost ZERO sporting events that are not televised, and so it’s fairly confounding to the US-based fan to be told “here’s the game you can watch”, rather than having the option of watching whichever game(s) fits the fancy.
This also has the benefit of being least disruptive to the players and home-and-home league structure.
No, playing league games here is a bad idea, and especially if the game played is anything as dour as the NFL match that took place in London yesterday…that was tripe!!
October 29th, 2007 @ 20:33Premiership games in the U.S would not make sense, in my opinion.
How would you decide who plays? Who gets the money? The teams? The stadium?
I reckon that smaller matches should be played in the U.S., something like how the European Super Cup is held in Monaco, or the World Club Championship in Japan. The Italian Super Cup was held in 2002 in Tripoli, Libya and in 2003 in the Giants stadium of New York. Maybe the Charity Shield or the Carling Cup final could be held in the U.S, maybe even a summer tournament in the U.S between 8 or so teams, considering the number of Premiership teams that tour the U.S. and have partnerships with U.S. football [and that’s association football, not NFL, forgive me but I feel saying soccer is a sin, especially if you’re English) teams.
October 29th, 2007 @ 22:40i would go to the games if they were played in us (which is where i live) but i doubt most people will so its a bad idea except if it happens then its good for me because i will be there for sure.
October 30th, 2007 @ 00:44Speaking as an Evertonian and having heard one of the RS’s owners on Radio City (a Merseyside local radio station) this morning 31/10/07, claiming this was inevitable..
I say this – I hope Liverpool FC do go off to Toronto…!
It’ll destroy them as a football club! – and nothing save Everton winning the league would give me greater pleasure than Liverpool ceasing existance!
Nil Satis Nilsi Optimum. We were here first 1878. Liverpool FC are just johnny come lately’s with fair-weather fans who only come out if theres glory to be had, but soon shut up shop when its tough!!!
COYB!
November 1st, 2007 @ 00:58I can agree with both, but the yes to premier league matches in america is the one i have to go with. I think that having internation pre-season mini tourneys is an amazing idea, i look up to Jaime Carragher and Steven Gerrard more than the pope looks up to god. If i could watch a Liverpool vs piece of fucking shit Man U gam here in the States, not only would i have achieved the dream of watching that match, i could die happy. I do plan on making a pilgrimage to Anfield when i graduate from high school, because i want to sit in the Kop and scream and get drunk all while watching a match, but it’s something i will probably only get to do once, so the EPL should definetly bring some matches over to the us. Especially to Orlando, Florida, that way i watch a match, and they go to Disney World, its a win win.
November 3rd, 2007 @ 01:16The club first and foremost that should be playing in any US match is Arsenal. The brand of football is sure to impress, but Americans are genreally used to dictating to others what is good, not the other way around. We’ll have a hard time over here I think adapting to the Premier League showing us what football is all about.
November 3rd, 2007 @ 05:34I agree that BPL games should NOT and NOT play in the US.
November 3rd, 2007 @ 12:29