Liverpool’s problems lie with Rafa
Ok, let’s get the bitching out of the way first. No, no one’s questioning Rafa’s record in the Champions League with Liverpool. No, I’m not questioning his record with Valencia in Spain.
And no, I’m not questioning the fact that he has had a limited budget to work with but he’s made some great signings. And again, no, not challenging the notion that in one-off games, not only is Rafa one of the best tacticians in football management, he just might also have Mourinho’s number.
In fact, I’ll set out my stall right now and say that Rafa Benitez is a better, more stable manager than Gerard Houllier and has definitely taken Liverpool forward in the Premiership and in Europe during his time.
And yes, Liverpool will do better in the future because of the extra money they have now (which amounts to paying 20m for Torres and then financing it by selling Bellamy and Cisse for 10m+).
Can we NOT raise those points in the comments? Please? I’m NOT arguing over all this. Thank you.
Now getting back to the article and the point I’m actually trying to make - as with any manager, you have some good points and bad points. If Wenger’s a master at nurturing talent and if his teams play beautiful football, he’s also capable of being too rigid with his system and of not having a Plan B for his sides.
If Ferguson’s the master of attacking football, he can be faulted for falling out with his best players and for some tactical mistakes in crucial matches in the last decade or so.
What about Rafa Benitez? He is a master tactician, and his transfer strategy is good. But when it comes to the Premiership race, Liverpool, under Rafa, have been found lacking.
In a nutshell, Rafa’s tactics are to defend first, to keep a clean sheet and to come away with one or two goals. A defensive mentality and pushing to control the game in midfield can work in spades for you IF you match it with the right offensive / counter-attacking strategy.
However, Rafa’s teams are disorganised in attacking from open-play.
One example - I made a point to compare the way each of the top four teams chose to attack the opposing penalty area during the last season. Chelsea were direct (more than the rest atleast), United attacked in the most numbers and Arsenal dominated in controlling the box around the area.
All three teams had their forward 6 move in unison, the wingers and strikers making runs and space for themselves.
Liverpool? You’d have the two central midfielders sitting back, the wingers cutting in but not pushing forward and invariably one of the strikers waited outside the box. In short, Liverpool’s attacks had no fluidity, no rhythm, no concert. Where you’d see 4-6 Arsenal shirts attacking the opposition box as one, you’d see 3 Liverpool shirts running ahead without backup.
This has nothing to do with the players and everything to do with the manager.
I’m not saying that Liverpool can’t win the league with Rafa - in fact under him they have their best chance in a long long time.
But for Liverpool to win the Premiership, it’s not just the players that Liverpool needs. It’s a change in Rafa that must take place as well. His teams have to be more aggressive, more clinical.
Rafa himself has to change - it’s a challenge for him, and as much as I think that he’s done well, I’m sure he can do better.
Maybe next year, maybe not. But with him in charge of Liverpool I can only see the Premiership becoming better and better tactically.
I think Liverpool’s attacking options are cut down when they play sissoko. He can run back, tackle, defend with the best of them, but going forward he is a liability and therefore as well as distrupting the opposition attack, he also disrupts Liverpool’s own attacking options.
Mascherano will prove to be a much better option for them, although I still have some concerns about the amount of free kicks he will give away.
I think Liverpool’s attacking options are cut down when they play sissoko. He can run back, tackle, defend with the best of them, but going forward he is a liability and therefore as well as disrupting the opposition attack, he also disrupts Liverpool’s own attacking options.
Mascherano will prove to be a much better option for them, although I still have some concerns about the amount of free kicks he will give away.
I think that’s a little shortsighted to put it politely.
He’s built his team from the back and is clearly adding the attacking players this summer with Torres in and Babel and Benayoun looking set to sign, it’s hard to play free flowing attacking football without the players to do it. These signings will go a long way towards that.
His Valencia sides played some of the best football I’ve seen from visiting sides at Anfield and I can’t see anything to suggest we won’t be doing the same in the near future.
Rafa has had to work with limited resources and players he inherited! You forget how bad we were when he took over. Biscan anyone?? The transformation and the string of inspired signings (alonso, sissoko, mascherano) has culminated in the signing of Torres. Now we have a queue of quality players wanting to play for the Reds. As for tactics rafa has acknowledged that a change is required hence signing wingers. He will have a break and watch out for further activity in January window!
I think you should watch Liverpool more often. May i suggest you have only ever seen Liverpool play against the top 3 teams in Engalnd. Liverpool can play great attacking football and they do quite often. They just lack the quality against the bigger teams. Something i hope we will put right summer.
I will not argue with you. As you pointed out, with Rafa liverpool are finding their feet. Now to counter a bit about change of mentality, I think that this is already taking place. You said about the two central defenders staying back. This will improve. That is why Mascherano was bought and Sissoko before him, to let Gerrard and Xabi wreak havoc in front. The wingers are also being purchased to beat players (Babel and Quaresma an example) and one can also see the improvement of Pennant. I think you are writing about something that is already taking place.
I think with the intent in the trasnfer market this summer it may prove to be the case that Rafa will go for a more attacking option at times. With Torres, Kuyt/Crouch, 2 attacking wingers and Gerrard bombing on from the middle, we will see more numbers in the box.
The problem has been about the type of players we had in midfield, I agree with sack the jugglers comments about Sissoko. His energy around the park is excellent and if we are looking to hold onto a game he is a freat option, but when we need to chase the game or really get at teams at home he isnt.
whats annoyed me the most whilst watching liverpool these past few years is playing one upfront and the striker crossing the ball, it might just be me but how many times does kuyt seem to come out to cross the ball in. we seem to be a team incapable of scoring from corners or crosses any other team a corner is an opportunity to score liverpool seem to do nothing with them
I tend to agree. Rafa is too defensive. There is no need to play four at the back and two defending midfielders and this is the reason why Liverpool are not able to attack in numbers. Sissoko is more of a hinderence than a benefit to the team as he can’t pass and should have been sold. Macho should have Gerrard alongside him and money should be found for two world class wide players. Also if a top quality centre back is not bought the title will continue to be a dream.
Nice article mate. Though I think arrival of Mascherano is going to help liverpool in this regard. With him as their defensive midfielder ( much better defensively than alonso and better on the ball than sissoko), Rafa can play gerrard in the center more (a normal 4-4-2) and consequently, a specialist right winger can be included, all of which will help in more positive football. They also do need a creative player in the hole as well. On the other hand, with typical Rafa line-up, I dont think Torres will be that important because liverpool dont create chances for strikers like Arsenal/Man.Utd do(anyways he’s not a great finisher either); thats why Tevez would have been an awesome signing for them rather than Torres.
Good article. As a Liverpool fan, I wouldn’t change Rafa for any other manager. He’s a tactical genius and also has the ability to take the best out of his players (Finnan, Carragher, Pennant). However, his biggest weakness is that his approach isn’t always positive. keeping a clean sheet is very important in Rafa’s eyes, rightly so, but that shouldn’t be at the expense of the effectiveness of our attacking threat. Just an example, we’ve probably got one of the best keepers in terms of delivery and the tallest striker in the prem, but while all other teams’ keepers send long balls towards their strikers, we keep on resorting to some short passes to Carra and Agger. I think that we would get much closer to the top two this season, but doubt we weill be able to win it, if we aren’t a bit more positve in our approach.
I think Rafa is realistic. He reconized that he didnt have the players to attack in numbers and for the last two years has made wingers his priority. Last year he was only able to get Pennant and therefore he had to play to what he had, the problem was that bellamy and kuyt (more bellamy because he is a better goalscorer) didnt produce. Thats why he’s changed that, bought Torres who he hopes will produce in the event that he cant land wingers and will need somebody to score goals in 1-0 scrappy affairs.
In Europe though where they cant defend against crouchy the tactics payed off far more as he was able to scrap a goal here and there and then we’d defend out the rest of the game
I think the article is correct as well as the guys who comment that the change is underway and it has had a lot to do with quality of the players. Remember Rafa bought Crouch because none of our strikers could hold the ball. He made the last third of the pitch playable. Cisse’s control was so poor that his pace was wasted. and Finnan and Risse are not wingers with Kewell’s injuries we had very few attacking options, little controlled pace and woeful crossing (Zenden). The movement from defense to attack was poor with the ball not delivered at the right moment and if it was poor finishing. Hence Crouch and subsequently Kuyt trying to do multiple jobs hold, cross and score. With world class wingers who turn defenses and can deliver crosses you can liberate the strikers and the midfield. Alonso will be twice as effective if he can pass to wingers and forwards who move quickly and intelligently (not Bellamy). Torres has been bought for the way he plays not just his goal record. If we get Quaresma and Babel supported by Kewell and Pennant we will have some of the best attacking forwards in the world who can move together a la Valencia. Kudos Rafa!
Hi, Ahmed, I think you got it all wrong! If you look at LFC games last season Rafa always tries to score first, then if possible nail a second before half time.
This would give any coach a chance to give other options a run out in the last 15-20 mins of the game.
Unfortunately many games ended in frustration because our strikers did not hit the net in the first 30 mins (unlike ManU - with loads of penalties). We never truly had real strikers up till now but attacking midfielders.
Hopefully with Torres it should be a different story. Last year we had many games with 10-15 corners and 8-10 shots on goal ending in draws. We need a striker to convert these stats into goals and we should have him now…
Like any other manager Rafa makes mistakes (CL final not giving Bellamy a run out in the end and playing SG upfront with Kuyt which they often found themselves obstructing each other).
But you did not mention Barca - with three formidable strikers upfront (Eto, Messi, Ronaldinho) how they faded out of the game. Milan - first half, Kaka never came in the game.
We have to wait till every player gives his part.
I don’t think Rafa was wrong to concentrate first on defense. All the best teams are built up from the back and go through a period when their defensive prowess is far greater than their attacking abilities. I feel you have ignored the real problem with Rafa in the PL which is his determination to keep rotating his squad. Teams like Bolton or Fulham are overcome on their home patches by a group of determined players who have been operating together consistently for months: chopping and changing against them is merely playing into their hands. If Rafa realises this, then Liverpool just might win the PL. Otherwise, those unexpected defeats away from home will continue into the foreseeable future and prevent any real PL success. Let’s hope that with players of the calibre of Torres, Kuyt, Gerrard and Alonso Rafa will allow a far more settled team this year. Perhaps he is on the point of realising that a policy which worked in Spain isn’t necessarily going to work in the PL.
Another fantastic peace of drivel by Bilal who clearly revels in drivel targeting Rafa. Then, should anyone put a similar point of view regarding the might Sir So&So then his little manc mates come on to slag everyone off.
Lost all respect for this blog as it clearly has a single-minded ambition to belittle a manager that has achieved far more than Ferguson did at this stage of his career. When will the fearful and somewhat jealous manc wasters stop thinking about the mighty reds and concentrate on what value they might have had if they had offered Hargreaves a contract and got him for free 18 months ago, of if they bid £3.5m for Carrick when he was at WetSpam, of far that matter any overpriced ‘great talent’ you ‘great manager’ has bought. Oh no, that would never do for the great red devils as if they don’t pay over the odds, Fergie might loos his rag and someone gets a boot in the face!!!!
Just take this and prove it wrong you sorry manc wasters, what had you ‘greatest ever British manager’ did at the same stage as Rafa is in now. You can choose age, number of clubs, or even the number of years he has been a ‘the big club’ and the sort of budgets they used. If any of you ‘intelligent commentators’ have anything to say, please do so. Manc planks
All im going to say is how long have the other managers been plying their trade in the prem??? far longer than Rafa so the critiscm is way wrong. Not only that i will bring up his current success in europe as it shows he’s progressing faster and further than the other managers you’ve mentioned.
We where in decline with Houllier in the league so stopping the rot was a much more acceptable target than jumping from 4th to 1st.
Tell me a manager who has done so well in such short periods of time with different clubs in different leagues?
absolutely right!!!
strikers are not the problem at liverpool.
we don’t have any playmaker or any other midfielder ( except gerrard) that can give the last pass or dribele and change the game ( do the unexpected…) what is more sad is that rafa doesn’t look or buy at any of those players, only “good mentaity”… “young”… “promosing”… “for the future”…..but not very good players.
instead of trying keep clean sheets he should try to score as much as possible because the best defense is offense!!!
please don’t forgate that we are talking about liverpool that use to play the best and beautiful football in europe!!! and now we are very good tactical team!!!!!!!
How people think they know it all about Rafa is beyond me.
I certainly don’t think I do, but it is obvious I know more than this Bilal character.
No. 1
If you notice, since Rafa has arrived we have had slow starts in the Premier league, but always seem to finish strongly, infact, in Rafa’s second season, after the first eight games of that season, we accumulated more points than any other Premier league team. So Rafa cant organise a team to win the league? quite the contrary in my opinion, we have gone on two long unbeaten runs without conceding goals for something like 12 matches straight. Hardly the form of no hopes in the league.
For me the problem with Rafa in the league is something that may never be able to change. Rafa likes to use his options, he likes to have all of his options ready and drilled. This means having to use squad rotation.
It is the same squad rotation that is costing Liverpool points early on in the season. If the squad at early parts of the season were as settled as other teams first 11. Which is a massive ask, I think then we would have a realistic chance of winning the PL as Liverpool always seem to get stronger as the season progresses under Rafa. Our players do be fitter, stronger and more tactically aware than the teams around us.
Where we have been lacking in recent seasons in decent quality in the forward positions, put it this way, I know we can go on about ifs and buts, but if we have had the quality in attack that Man U, Arsenal or Chelsea have had over the past three season we would be a far far more potent team in attack. People think Liverpool are a negative side. That remark couldn’t be further from the truth. For evidence of this I look to some of the biggest games of the season, if not the biggest for us.
Barca away, Chelsea at home and away. Liverpool pressed up high up the pitch, away at Chelsea we seen Chelsea sit very deep and let Liverpool do all the pushing up the field. So Liverpool went to the league champions home and the league champions ended up playing counter attacking football against Liverpool who were away from home, hardly a negative approach from Liverpool. Same thing happened at Anfield.
We beat the reigning European champions in their own back yard. Again, hardly evidence of being a negative side.
There is no doubting that Rafa is more suited to the champions League and European football. Still though, I don’t think Rafa has to change much to be able to genuinely challenge and hopefully win the Premier League, what is needed is some real attacking quality in the team, hopefully Torres is of that quality.
Maybe aswell, not so many signing in the summer, instead bringing in maybe two or three each transfer window, that can only help the squad to settle and get off to a better start since not too many team changes are being made.
So in a nutshell, if the squad is settled early on, and we have genuine attacking threat to match the others. We can win the premier league.
A big point to make is that Liverpool constantly unserachieves in the league, losing matches that they should win. They are terribly unpredictable and much of it stems from this strategy.
You think that with Crouch’s size, Rafa would have used him more as a target man, like Mourinho has done with Drogba - fly the ball in, pull it down and wait for the attack, particularly on the wings, to catch up. But Liverpool, watching them in the CL semifinal, were terribly slow, focusing on non-eminesional runs and passes that had little chance of success. If Chelsea had been decent that game at all (Drogba missed two chances in front of an open net), the Blues are in Athens replacing the Reds in the final.
I think you make a good point and one that has frustrated me for years about Liverpool. But I also think that if Rafa would have gotten the wingers he tried to get last summer then we would see a Liverpool attack that is just as you describe. He has been looking for the quality wingers who would support the attack since his arrival, and hopefully we will get them now. I would also like to see Xabi attacking more and used as a central midfielder rather than a defensive mid as I think he’d be more effective.
Frank
In the early stages of Ferruson’s career he didn’t have the resources that Benitez has to build a team. In the last few years Liverpool have spent as much if not more on players as United have and what do they have to show for it? Rafa has brought in between 10 and 15 players maybe even more and only the recent buys of Mascherano and Torres have shown any ambition. Before them the only decent signings he has made are Alonso and Agger. His failure rate is greater than his success rate and when you look at Ferguson even excluding this season in the time Rafa has been at Liverpool he brought in Carrick who was a success, Vidic - success, Evra - success, Van Der Sar - success. In the few years preceding that there were some mistakes (Veron, Kleberson and Djemba-Djemba) but Ferguson’s success rate is much higher than Rafa’s.
Right where do we begin, argh I know March 2007 and the day when your team Mr Bilal won the title effectively at Anfield. There was only one team attacking that day and they wore RED shirts, our finishing was poor, and has been for a number of seasons, however we attacked controlled most of the match and then conceed from a free in the last minute. Actually go back a year and the same thing happened at OT, I’m sure you still remember Cisse’s miss of an open goal from 6 yards fondly, however it was that result which gained you the 2nd place that season and last season you happened to be in the right place at the right time. Cech got injured, Cudinci, Terry got injured and Chelsea’s defence went la la for a month or 2. Unfortunately for us we were gone by that time down to a horrible run of away games at the start of the season, Sheff Utd (we have a horrible record there), Everton 12.45 straight after a international week (cheers SKY), Bolton (where we outplayed them something like 14 LFC shots, 5 Bolton, their first goal was a disgrace Reina didnt handle the ball outside his area the linesman should have been demoted for the season) Chelsea (we were the better side but we always lose there) and then you lot where we kept your pitch fresh for 2 weeks!Well that amount of shite would. Please dont tell me you dont have bogey grounds and teams, Portsmouth immediately spring to mind. The proble for Rafa in the league is simple 1st year shite squad massive injury crisis, (which helped us in the Champions League, who can forget Igor in La Coruna and Leverkusen) and strange league. 2nd year Better squad but to many dropped points early on fecked it, encouraging run took us near but we were never really in it. Last year has already been summed up however something has not been mentioned and that is Rafa doesn’t like 4-4-2, he prefers 4-2-3-1 and this how he done so well at Valencia, ensuring a tight defence whilst Barca and madrid scored more goals Rafa won the prize twice in three years. This according to you doesn’t happen in England, well explain Chelsea winning two leagues, and come to mind the 1995/96 season when your lot won the league despite being the most defensive out of the 3 teams involved in the title race that year, Newcastle and Liverpool were far more attacking than united but united won the league. If Liverpool start well this year we wont be far away
its a valid point, and your earlier comments, show that rafa is taking the right direction - but from the latest signings and speculation - its clear he is working towards the areas that you have criticised.
firstly, look at our defence, virtually no goals come from finnan, agger, carra and riise (when he’s leftback) - sissoko and mascherano have never scored, alonso got a couple and pennant one last season - and gerrard was the only scoring multiple goal midfielder. 30 odd came from crouch and kuyt and a handful from bellers.
if transfers and speculation go the way we want them too. we can potentially look at a team that has very attacking wingers i.e babel/simao/quaresma that score 5-10 goals a season each, torres, kuyt and crouch will have crosses on a plate - voronin is younger, fitter, faster replacement for fowler and could easily chip in with more than fowlers 5. Gerrard will be able to remain in the middle and still contribute goals. I firmly believe we will score more next season than the previous 10 - and that our defence plus anchor man will be the main defensive unit. Away games will be different, with i imagine, torres deployed as a lone striker and an extra anchorman coming in to midfield. i feel the biggest sticking point this season will be between who plays out of mascherano, alonso and sissoko - crouch will get enough games as 3rd striker, and i dont think we will hear to much whinging out of voronin in his 1st season.
To comment on what Frank is saying I can only aggree to most of it. I am a Manu fan and I have lost a great deal of respect for Fergie because of his transfer tactics of late. True, he is buying fantastic and proven players as well as investing in future talent, but at and increadibly inflated price. Hargreaves, Carrick and then the talk of Berbatov this summer shows that he seems to be one step late in taking decisions; all could’ve been bought sooner for a third of the cost.
On compirison of him and Rafa I would like to point out their similarities. Fergie comes in and inherits a team he has to rebuild in a time of, almost, Liverpool dominance for over a decade. He gets older players for short term, and younger players for “three-to-six-years-down-the-road”. His club patiently waited and they were finally rewarded for their patience at the nick of time, just before impatient people gave him the old boot in the backside.
This is exactly what Rafa has been doing. He has worked hard to bring in young players for the youth- and reserves and in a year or to, Liverpool might reap heavily from these rewards I fear.
There is no denying his tactical brilliance and his offensive faults have been circumstantial I feel, due to funding problems, and his way of rebuilding the team. Soon, all too soon, he will have completed his first rebuilding part of his program and then, as with Fergie, comes continuity with his younger recruits.
Liverpool have lacked stability for years, but as their youth-developement program has been rebolstered by Benitez, experience comes at an earlyer age for players. I fear they are about to strike back with a vengance, and can only be grateful of the heavy investment by Sir Alex this summer.
Yogi
You can’t possibly be blaming the PL for Liverpool’s inability to score against Bolton and Everton and it’s not like United didn’t have trouble with injury with our whole back 4 missing for 3 or 4 weeks towards the end.
Absolute piffle!!
Liverpool safety first? Just watch them play at home. I saw every league match bar 2 last season, and they ALWAYS come out of the blocks first. Very often, they are camped in the opposition half for most of the match. Check your facts!!
Unless of course you are referring to solely the away matches. You could argue that at times, defending was the priority - probably due to a lack of points away. Also consider the previous year - you do not get 82 points in the prem by being defensive.
Also, as the season went on, there were countless games (home and away) where central midfielders were getting into the box.
Finally, consider the signings this summer. All attacking players signed or touted.
Another article for the ‘lets diss Liverpool with a poorly researched article’ pile
I hope Rafa has learned not to play Sissoko and Mascherano together, because none of them creat anything, against Aston v last year it was obvios. Who he partner together in attack will also be crucial, and will he only play with one striker in some games, which i think is to defensive. Pennant is a good player but he scores only a couple of times in a season, and therefore Gerrard maybe still has to play on the wing. Why LIverpool want Benayoun i really cant understand, Adam Hammill should get his chance instead. I hope we do sign Ryan Babel, he will be a future star, but i am not sure he will be a succes right away, he is only 20. If Kewell can find his form and stay fit, Liverpool maybe have a little chance of winning the league, i hope they do.
Liam O’Kelly, please be serious, when was the last time we spent 20-30m for a player, and how many of those do you have in your squad. When fergie first went to manu you were still and always were the biggest spenders in the league. Be serious please. As for those who show ambition, you are telling me that Carrick is better than Alonso! You are a manc for sure!
Orn, I cant believe you’re a manc, you talk too much sense lad. One think I would pull you up on, fergie won nothing for years, while Rafa has achieved Miracles with a squad that is only now beginning to be his own.
Frank
I never said that Carrick was better than Alonso I just said that Carrick was a good signing and I also said that Alonso was a good signing my point was that there were too many bad signings made by Rafa like Gonzalez and Sissoko which Ferguson used to do but in recent seasons has made good signings which have improved the team and in reply to your question United have 2 £20-30 million players Rooney who has been great and still has 10 or more years to play and Ferdinand who has been a solid defender and I would say has earned his fee back. But look at the other signings like Ronaldo £12 million and now is worth £30, Vidic £6 million and is now worth £15-20 million. Liverpool have 2 £20 million+ signings in their team now just like United in Torres and Mascherano and might add another before the end of the transfer window.
im sorry but sissoko is not a bad signing, he is one of the best ball winners i have ever seen, that is why some of europes top clubs are interested in him, when he plays liverpool seem to have more possesion, he can only pass the ball a few yards yes but he does not often give the ball away and there are other players who can be relyed upon for creativity
Liam O’Kelly
I am only answering because you are making me laugh and I am at work and shouldn’t, should I!
To say Sissoko is a failure is to say that Verron was a success, so I will leave it at that for that one. PS another 28m, which is just right for Furgie. Of course, Juve & Barca would seek a total failure such Sissoko as they don’t understand the market as well as you.
While there are at least 5 Djemba Djemba’s to any Gonzales, who despite his lack of success still contributed about 10 times what the one who was so good they named him twice.
Renaldo was about to move to LFC for 6m, and only his wage packet stopped the deal, only for Furgie to choose to spend twice as much only a week later, class.
Now we get to Hargreaves free or 17m, ehh, 17m. Carrick, 3.5m or a8m, ehh, 18m. if you compare the amount spent by Furgie to that spent by Maureen, you will find they compare very well, while poor old Rafa has to go finding the Pennants of this world when he wants Alaves & Sambrosa.
Get real and thank the heavens your glorious manager was knighted for 1 European cup and has had so much money to play with, at times with so little sense, yet he still kept his job for all those years. We had managers who won three European cups, incredible number of championships and still they got ignored.
So we mainly play two central holding midfielders with attacking wingers and two strikers? And Fergie has Ronaldo and Nani on the wings for the new season, Rooney and Tevez up front, and Carrick and Hargreaves in the middle. Hargreaves is essentially a holding player, and whilst Carrick may be a little better at distributing the ball, it sound like we have incredibly similar formations and approach to attacking. The wingers and strikers set the teams apart in their individual abilities to take on defenders and finish chances which I resentfully accept Man Utd are better at. But otherwise I don’t agree.
Quote : I’m not questioning the fact that he has had a limited budget to work
Should have stopped there and not bothered writing the article. Rafa had six options available for up front and both wings in the CL Final. They cost a combined total of not much more than 20mill. He has done superbly given the state of the squad he inherited and the funds he has had to work with.
Although I agree that Veron and Djemba-Djemba were bad transfers (see no.23) You can’t honestly say that Sissoko is a good one, he hardly ever plays and now is being paid higher wages this season in which he has Gerrard, Alonso and Mascherano ahead of him in centre-mid so he is wasting even more money and KJF it’s no good winning the ball if you pass it straight back to the opposition and I know a lot of Liverpool fans who wanted him sold and I didn’t class Veron in the 20 millon plus category because he played for 2 seasons and still got 15 million back for him and maybe he wouldn’t have been regarded a flop if he didn’t have to live in scholes and Keanes shadow same could be said with Forlan who was overshadowed by RvN and was a hell of a lot more prolific than Crouch when he played. Anyway who cares unless you are a season ticket holder or regularly go to matches (I try to go once a season) then it’s not your money they’re spending.
4231 will not win us the league - just checkout what total points you need to win since Chelsea came on the scene (the trend upwards was already happening before then) - playing two DMs with our full backs is too defensive. If Rafa insists on two non-scoring midfielder s (and Momo/Masher/Alonso all fall into this category) then we have to go with Gerrard on the right - and even then we won’t win enough games to be serious contenders. There is a limit to what you can achieve with such a defensive minded approach.
If Rafa can be brave enough to play only one DM against teams that ‘park the bus’ YossiB would be a good option at the top of the diamond. We also need a ball playing center back if Rafa persists with two DMs. I don’t think the tactics that won La Liga will work in the PL where 89 points is the lowest winning total in four years (90,95,91) compared with 82, 84, 77, 76*max. He needs to demonstrate he has knows what it takes to win in this country. He needs a good mentality.
If Rafa preservers with a flat back 4 and two non-scoring DMs then we will only win the league if it returns to two points for a win. If we play three at the back and wing backs in Johnny Rockets and Alves then Rafa can keep his 2 DMs as long as we have a striker who can convert his chances.
Rafa has referred to the ‘English’ way of winning at home and not losing away - giving at least a two points per game average - if you look at the PL the last three years the Points per game of the winners was at least 2.2 - The way we play at the moment almost guarantees us finishing 3rd or 4th - but it’s time to move on and take a few risks in order to get the extra (38*2 gives 76 points, 38*2.2 gives 83) 7 or eight points.
When Rafa won La Liga his record was :
Season Pos. Pl. W D L GS GA P
2001-2002 1D 1 38 21 12 5 51 27 75
2003-2004 1D 1 38 23 8 7 71 27 77
In his second winning season the team scored 71 goals - 20 more than the previous victorious team while keeping the same standard defensively.
77 points will not win our league - the standard now is 85+
20 extra goals only yielded two more points - you’d expect more, but it was enough to win the league.
I look at that record and think that if you give him a Sofa when he asks for a Sofa we’ll be back on top sooner rather than later.
Fair points to you, I agree we have been too static in attacking. But then again, I think you are generalizing way too much with both how we attack and how the teams in your comparison attack. We have different set ups for attacking play with Benitez in charge, which leads me to the following point - Rafa has very much a pragmatic approach to games, he adapts the gameplan according to what players we have available, what opponents we play and under what conditions, and also considers the grand scheme of things regarding our club (rotation policy f.i). So who are you to say that the faults of our attacking play is solely down to Rafa? He can’t be blamed for players not doing what they are supposed to? Last season he relied quite heavily on wingers getting into the box in dangerous areas (with bellamy/kuyt sometimes providing the cross) yet it happened way too seldom.
If he has players available that can contribute in the way required, then Im pretty sure we will see a more fluid attacking game. Last season our attacking game went faltering a lot of times due to the lack of threat down the left flank. Gonzalez rarely was on spot inside the box. Also from the right, Pennant still is’nt naturally getting into dangerous positions inside the box if the flow of play goes trough the left flank.. I think the recent (including the rumoured) additions to the squad will provide attacking provess in exactly the way we where lacking last season. Players who know how to/have the pace to get into dangerous positions with great timing. We are going to have players who are prolific to get behind defences in different match situations and hopefully they will have the understanding of each other and the game that could be seen between Kuyt and Gerrard last season.
However, if I disregard certain aspects of our attacking play last season, I can see us heading towards a more dynamic attacking play WITH the signings we have made and are about to make. Im thinking of interchanging between the most attacking roles (flanks, forwards), fluid movement and a direction towards an ideal image of Arsenals attacking play during their recent peaks. Comparing player for player, you can make sense of it: henry-torres, kuyt-bergkamp, crouch-kanu, voronin/babel-wiltord.. Ofc there are individual differences, but you get the picture. Im not suggesting that we will play exactly like them during that era, rafa is much too strategically astute for that and football has changes since then but that there will be similarities. I sincerely hope we can improve on efficiency, but Im not sure that there will be a dramatic change in that. However, I can see us creating more chances and improving a lot on our counter-attacking play. OFC improving our efficiency on set-pieces would be a tremendous boost. One of our major short-comings last season was too few goals from the midfield in particular (the attackers chipped in with the required part). Improvement in that area might reflect how we fare next season, both on the pitch and in the table.
I agreed with Alex. Last season, our strikers and forwards are not clinical enough in finishing the numerous goal chances. That’s why we drop plenty of points.With Torres, we hope he will improve the scoring ratio (though i still have doubt that he is the man to score in every game). That’s is why we are trying to bring another quality striker ie. Gilardino of AC milan before the season starts.
Frank
1 sissko cant pass the ball at all let alone 5 meters
2 Stating sissko a failure and Veron a success means Veron was succesful, which makes sissko more of a failure
3 5 Djemba Djemba’s to 1 gonzales, that was about the gap in quality, gonzales is a joke and liverpool have had many like him eg. Zenden, Nunez, Mori, Josemi, Cisse, Le Tallec, Pongolle, Diao, Luzi, Diarra, CHeyrou, Diouf, Abel Xavier, Kirkland, Biscan. over the past 5 or 6 years.
4 As for Ronaldo move to liverpool under what premise. Manchester United have first refusal for any players at Sporting Lisbon
5 Hargreaves 17m well what can I say. well the truth is that we dont pay 17 million up front we pay approx. 10m and the rest if he is successful, we dont play down the figure like Liverpool do with Fernando Torr-ientes, but then again we expect to have success so that what we are going to pay but liverpool dont expect success so the figures may indeed be correct.
6 Im not entirely sure of this one but I have seen it on more than 1 occasion. liverpool has spent more money in the last 3 years than Manchester united has.
7 As for Sir Alex Ferguson he has done alot for football not just won a trophy or 2, he has been a so called ambassador, so please do not disrespect the man.
8 Frank your a muppet!
liam o’kelly sissoko does not win the ball and pass it straight back to the oposition, you are pretty much making things up as you go along because you do not know much about what you are disgussing, sissoko it seems “hardly ever plays” because he was injured, otherwise he has been a key player
Have you had a look at the final league table for the last two season’s mate? Who finished above who between Arsenal and Liverpool? You’re praising Wenger’s style of football but ignoring the fact that Arsenal finished behind Liverpool for the last 2 seasons.
Absolutely ridiculous article!
The only reason Liverpool finished so far behind Man Utd last season was because of the most difficult fixture list possible for the start of the season. Away matches against Everton, Man Utd, Chelsea, Bolton in the first few weeks of the season (while Man Utd and Chelsea were playing the likes of Waftord, Charlton, etc.) meant we were playing catch-up for the rest of the season. This was made all the more difficult with a lot of our players returning from the world cup. The last 3 or 4 games of the season were played using our reserves since we gave up on the title and decided to concentrate on the Champions League. The 21 points gap does not reflect the difference in quality between Man Utd and Liverpool. An easier fixture list for the coming season will ensure a much tighter race for the title. Rafa will show you how football is played next season! YNWA
Had to add my two pennies worth.
Sissoko a bad signing!! Don’t be a mug. Firstly, he has been in the liverpool team for two seasons, and has been a key player in those two seasons, except for when he has been injured.
Also if Rafa decided that he was no longer needed due to the amount of talent at his disposal in the middle, he could sell him at twice the price he bought him for, to any number of super-clubs.
However, being such a flop, Rafa and the board, offered him a new improved contract, as he is considered a very good player by everyone involved in Liverpool FC.
A very intelligent analysis but fall short of 1 important point. Rafa has not much attacking option at his disposal, at least not a few trustable one who can deliver week in and week out. I’m talking about world class players. He’s got Crouch, Bellamy and Kuyt who are hardly world class but only decent players. Maybe Kuyt is slightly better and have a chance to be a world class. He’s got Pennant and Gonzalez on the attacking wings and only Pennant looks promising but not yet the world class type. Gonzalez dont deliver, harry got injured and Fabio Aurelio is beginning to settle into the game and broke his leg. He has limited options. Gerrard is attacking in the middle but at times when Liverpool struggle upfront, he has to run back and help out and became like a defensive midfielder.
But now, he has got great if not world class attacking player in Fernando Torres, potentially signing premiership proven Yossi Benayoun who can score vital goals, make important run-in and create space like Robert Pires and Freddie Ljungberg for Arsenal during their prime, and potentially signing great talent like Babel and Quaresma who are very attacking minded and fast. Liverpool will be very much an attacking or a counter attacking team this time, although not exactly like Arsenal. When the other teams start to play negatively and trying to be hard to break down, i would expect Liverpool to start throwing in all the high ball for Torres and Crouch like last season. This is very important. I remember quite a number of occasion when Arsenal lost the game for playing beautiful football but unable to break down defenses. Personally, I cant wait for the season to begin. This is the most exciting time in the Premiership. Come on Liverpool!
Liam O’Kelly, since you cant check stats and facts, I can’t be bothered to reply to your nonsense.
Plank, sorry Jim
Let me answer your points one by one.
1 sissko cant pass the ball at all let alone 5 meters – Frank: - true, but he can terrify Barca into submission all on his own.
2 Stating sissko a failure and Veron a success means Veron was succesful, which makes sissko more of a failure. - Frank: - sarcasm is the lowest form of humour but at least most would recognise it.
3 5 Djemba Djemba’s to 1 gonzales, that was about the gap in quality, gonzales is a joke and liverpool have had many like him eg. Zenden, Nunez, Mori, Josemi, Cisse, Le Tallec, Pongolle, Diao, Luzi, Diarra, CHeyrou, Diouf, Abel Xavier, Kirkland, Biscan. over the past 5 or 6 years. - Frank:- interesting you mention mainly players brought by previous management or second/third tear players Rafa has been forced to go for, and yet he still manages to win far more than you precious Furgie did during his first 3 seasons.
4 As for Ronaldo move to liverpool under what premise. Manchester United have first refusal for any players at Sporting Lisbon. – no such agreement before Ronaldo deal, you clearly have no idea of facts at all!!!
5 Hargreaves 17m well what can I say. well the truth is that we dont pay 17 million up front we pay approx. 10m and the rest if he is successful, we dont play down the figure like Liverpool do with Fernando Torr-ientes, but then again we expect to have success so that what we are going to pay but liverpool dont expect success so the figures may indeed be correct. – Frank: - comparisons between hargreave signing and that of Torres leads me to think you are a typical manc, no brain at all. When was Torres available on a free? and why didn’t Furgie go for him when he has been monitoring him for 7 years!!!!!! Had you made a comparison with Rooney or Teves, then I would have had some respect for you point of view.
6 Im not entirely sure of this one but I have seen it on more than 1 occasion. liverpool has spent more money in the last 3 years than Manchester united has. – Frank: - try to get facts, especilay as you can count the number of players you have paid 10m or more for and the do a comparison on hwt we have done. Also try to account for sales, which I know your Furgie is very good at.
7 As for Sir Alex Ferguson he has done alot for football not just won a trophy or 2, he has been a so called ambassador, so please do not disrespect the man.- Franl: - it’s the disrepsct that you manc plank are showing to the best manager in the l;eague that is pulling me to tyhis site to put you planks right.
8 Frank your a muppet! – Frank: - from a sad and clearly brainless mac, I take that as a complement.
Frank
Since when is the best manager in the league a manager who hasn’t even won it yet and probably wont. I would call Mourinho the best manager in the league before I said it about Benitez. And look at the spending so far this Summer. United have bought 3 soon to be 4 world class players for £50 million, we are taking Tevez on loan until 2009 at a cost of £3 million a year oh but then I forgot according to Liverpool there is no need for loan deals in the top flight exept of course Mr. Mascherano. It’s just like Gerrard diving and then post-match saying that diving is wrong, but of course because it’s the amazing Stevie G and because he is English the media wont go after him for blatant diving the way that they do Ronaldo who gets assaulted every game and once in a while tries to prevent injury and get out of the way when players come to try and break his legs. I know Ronaldo dives but it’s one thing to dive and another thing to dive and then say to the world that diving is wrong
P.S. All my comments are fact even go look them up
Liam O’kelly…you are living in dreamland, since when was Anderson ‘world class’ ?, since when was Nani ‘world class’?, i’ll except Tevez is, but i have my doubts that Hargreaves is ‘world class’ too. As usual people are just looking at the price tag and thinking it means quality, the fact is united have taken huge risks in spending that money and only time will tell.
now as for the article, yeah the writer seems extremely short sighted, all you’ve done is state obvious faults, if we didnt have them we’d of won the league in the last 3 years. i think you’ve been playing too much football manager mate,it takes years to build a side that can challenge, unless your chelsea (lets not forget ranieri’s spending though). rafa has came in and built a strong competitive side that can compete with the best, as seen in europe. now we’re trying to add the icing on the cake, so why are we judging in pre-season? get real, lets see if rafa’s attacking spending spree will pay off huh?
….
In rafa we trust
A few things worth mentioning:
If you want to talk diving, the media tend to highlight foreign players doing it rather than British ones. Why I don’t know. Take Joe Cole for example. A shameless dive in the recent game against Brazil - he went over before the player even touched him. Joe Cole is one of the biggest divers in the PL, but he rarely gets caught or picked out.
Second, you can argue all day about bad buys and good buys but the fact is, ALL the top four managers have had mixed results. And some get more publicity than others. Man Utd missed Keane for a while, but have now got the balance back. Arsenal has missed Viera since he went, but the media think he hasn’t been missed?
Thirdly, I thought Liverpool had actually bought Mascherano - I remember some sort of fee was involved.
Fourth, you can diss this player and that, but to take Sissoko for example, is only in his early 20’s. The only thing missing from his game is accurate passing. His tackling and energy are superb for such a young player.
Fifth, articles like this are never objective. How can they be if written by a non-fan of the team in question who evidently does not watch the teams they write about every week. These sort of ‘authors’, write ‘controversial’ pieces like this which they know will stir up a storm and then they will run and never come back to answer their critics.
CHICKENS if you ask me.
Now, now Liam O’Kelly, don’t get your dummy dirty on the floor, and certainly don’t start spitting it out. Reading your comments cements my feeling that you need a brain transplant in order to be able to sustain a debate with any intelligence, but hay, your only a poor manc, probably from Surry.
Really because seeing as how you are the most intelligent person in the world you would be able to tell that I have an Irish name and I see that that you had no answers to what I said you had to resort to an insult.
P.S. I’m not even English and I know that it’s spelt Surrey so don’t go insulting my intelligence you Scouse bindipper.
Liam O’Kelly, firstly there are more Irishmen outside of the emerald isle. Secondly, I don’t need to answer your point as they are pointless, and I don’t want to debate with the most intelligent but someone who actual knows what they are talking about.
Lets make sense of what you are stating in your last comment: -
I really don’t care who you think is the best manager, but it’s a manc blog that spends so much time belittling Rafa that brings this on you bunch of planks.
Now, lets look at the spending this summer and every summer, get some real analysis and then come back to make any argument that makes sense!!!!!
As for what Rick Parry said, he was saying it in general and he is right. None of the big clubs need the loan system, if anything, its detrimental to the smaller clubs as the big boys can monopolise the ownership of the best young talent and then loan them out to smaller clubs till they are ready to come back.
SG dose dive but never as badly as some of your fave mancs or even worse the players who play for the man you think is the best in the business. The same man whos team dived your lot out of the champions league, which I remember rather well.
This blog spends all its time slagging us off and then you poor plank mancs get upset when people point out how small minded and limited you lot are.
Liverpool spent £20-30 million (Maybe more) last year (Kuyt, Mascherano, Bellamy, Agger, Pennant, Gonzalez) and united made a profit. This season Liverpool will spend about £40 million and will regain about £15 million United Will spend £50 million and make at least £10 million back with the sales of Smith, Richardson and hopefully Silvestre so tell me how do United spend more?
Last season Liverpool spent upwards of £30 million (Kuyt, Bellamy, Mascherano, Gonzalez, Pennant) meanwhile United spent £18m but made 22m from sales of RvN and Obi Mikel. Liverpool so far this Summer have spent 20m on Torres with another 15m for Babel on the way and don’t bet against more new signings. They will make 15m on sales. United this Summer will spend a total of around 50m and will make 10m+ on sales of Smith, Richardson and hopefully Silvestre. I don’t think I can make more sense than that so tell who spends more?
Liam O’Kelly, your beginning to talk sense, though you forget that we are deconstructing one squad and rebuilding anew. Lets compare what Furgie did when he first arrived at Manure to what is going on at LFC now, when he took 6 seaosn to get sniff of any silver. There has not been a need to exchange insults until your lot on this blog kept insisting on belittling Rafa.
What really amazes me is the number of Chelsky and Manure blogs dedicated at belittling and insulting the mighty reds even though those two teams have finished ahead of us for the last two seasons. What is it that makes you lot feel so insecure that you need to spend so much time thinking and writing about us?
It took Ferguson 6 seasons because when he took over United were almost slipping into mid table and he had to steady the ship. When Benitez took over his team were one of the top 4 and he has had enough money to fix the problems that they had as shown above. He has bought 3 good centre/defensive mids but still hasn’t managed to find any good wingers after going through Gonzalez and Zenden on the left this season and it doesn’t really look like Arsenal reject Pennant is doing much good and Babel wont fix this as winger is his second position. Liverpool need top quality wingers for both sides if they want to challenge the real “mighty reds”
Liam.. As your’e a Manc I thought you’d figured out that it’s not HOW much you spend or the rep of the player you buy that makes the difference. Before last season you bought Carrick. Quite expensive for one player and questionably worth the money you paid, considering his rep but still. It got you the balance you needed and you won the title. It’s one of the significant factors contributing. Compare that to Chelseas erratic spending last silly season and you looked like you stood no chance. It’s all about getting the right ingredients and getting them to work. Oh, Vidic was an incredibly important acquisition for you in that sense - to eradicate junkie-rio’s shortcomings.
For Utd I can see Nani and Anderson becoming good acquisitions in a few years time, but for now - Giggs and Ronaldo will be your main wingers. Not bad - top class. Hargreaves will provide cover for Carricks role, and be a flexible, usable player but no future Scholes. Hardly a lot better than O’shea tbh. Tevez is a great player and if all goes well he’ll be a tremendous asset, but I wonder how well he will work with Rooney? They are quite similar and shrek-boy wont stand not being first choice, if that would happen. You’ve added in depth and for the future but you have’nt raised your top-level, necessarily.
So, with all due respect, regardless the amount you´ve spent - it’s pretty much in the open on how any of the top-teams fare. We’ve (LFC) been getting the missing pieces in the puzzle and we don’t know how it will work out, but I can see us playing a lot more fluidly and with wingers in a higher position than before. Time will tell if Rafa will be proven successful or not, as for the coming season. Can’t wait!
Liam.. Think you are under-estimating Pennant. Since january he’s been improving steadily and have played on a really high and consistant level. Also, Kewell is back like a new signing and he is a class act when uninjured. I think Babel will prove you wrong also. Rafa’s got his sights set on something.. three new players in who with great effect exploit and create space between the lines: voronin, babel, benayoun..
Hmm..
I don’t think this blog is about reasoned debate, its set up to belittle Rafa, though Bilal seems fine writing the drivel easier than responding while he leaves his manc mates to defend his attacks on Rafa, and they do get upset when the shoe is on the other foot.
If true comparisons are made, I don’t think there is a manager out there to match the achievements of Rafa both in Spain and England. The results obtained from the talent and finance available to him while opposing the worlds richest clubs in Barc, Real, Chelski and Manure is clear for all to see.
I think this type of blog is based on jealousy and fear, as they know we are on the rise and soon to be the true dominating force we once were. Otherwise, why spend so much time thinking about Rafa, when your club is about to introduce some 80m worth of talent?
I never said that Babel was a bad player I just said that winger isn’t his best position and Benayoun is a good player but he is another central player which may lead to players having to be accomodated to make way for him ala Chelsea and I fear Stevie may be made a permanent winger where quite frankly he is average just like Pennant. I quite liked Kewell during his time at Leeds and rated him quite highly but since he came to Liverpool he just hasn’t been the same quality.
Liam, facts (stats) disagree with your view on stevie as a winger. He actually scores more goals/game when starting from the right. Besides, Stevies role has never been as an out/out winger. I think we will see both Babel and Benayoun playing more in un-orthodox-winger-roles starting from both flanks. Picture Ljungberg/Pires a few years back with Henry stretching opposition defences.. Ofc, Rafa won’t turn into wenger, but I think that kind of attack will be implemented into our range of possibilities.
Another fact is that Babel plays most his games for Ajax to the left in a forward-3. He is not the typical winger-type, that’s correct, but he knows how to do his job from that position - in other words - he wont be played out of position. I don’t think Benayoun will have any problems drifting inwards from the right, nor exploiting space outside his defender - if given, either..
Nobody knows at this times how each player will fare, but if you try to look at what roles they might have and how they might play then you might see where rafa is aiming with his buys.
I also disagree on the “leeds-myth”. Season 05/06 Kewell was uninjured most of the time and he had a great season, really. It also showed, In gerrard thriving from the right and us getting more than 80 points. Well, gerrard only started 40% of the games from the right, so maybe I should’nt draw too many conclusions, but in fairness, back then we didn’t have any decent player to the right except gerrard. Which tells it’s own tale on the job done by kewell that season.
IF, and that is actually two IFs (albeit assumable ones), Pennant continue where he left off last season and developes in the same manner as he did last season, I see no reason why he could’nt be top-3 of the premiership right-sided-wingers come the end of the coming season.
Fact Cesspool did worse last year than the previous year, nice progression
06/07
Manchester United (CHAMPIONS) 38 28 5 5 83 27 +56 89
Chelsea 38 24 11 3 64 24 +40 83
Cesspool 38 20 8 10 57 27 +30 68
ohh I just wanted to show you scum the final table again
how bad do you feel. HAHAHAHAHA
@Hmm..
“Another fact is that Babel plays most his games for Ajax to the left in a forward-3″
FACT=Ajax plays diamond midfield. NEVER forward 3. (They are trying to emulate Total Football). That is why it is so difficult for just any striker to excel there. It is actually a rule at Ajax that they will stick to that formation…no matter what.
Ahmed, regarding this article… I don’t believe Rafa is a bad coach. In fact I believe he is a brilliant coach. Hoever, he need to ‘adapt’ a bit more to make football attractive - just like Jose was forced by the owner to change his appraoch.
Rafa shares Jose’s original approach - First wrap up the title, and Then put on a show for the fans. Chelsea did it pretty well in past seasons, however last season they started to play a bit more attacking because of Roman’s issue over Sheva. The problem with Liverpool is, they never really get to the position where they can start playing entertaining football. I think this “Safety first” appraoch is what Rafa need to abandon and find a balance just like Jose is. Btw, I thnk Chelsea will be on fire this year because Jose is a quick learner.
Liverpool are still way behind manutd cause man u hav spent well