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How do you rate players?

25 posts - Started 8 months ago by Rhian Joseph - Latest reply from scotgun -

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  1. Rhian Joseph
    rhianjoseph

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    Posted 8 months ago #

    Once and for all this must be settled....By what criteria do we judge who is good from who isn't...
    How do we decide that someone is overrated as opposed to underrated....

    As you all know I believe in facts and statistics, for if not by those anybody could say their opinion is valid. I understand fully when people say that awards are sometimes flawed but humans by nature are flawed and so to use that as a counterargument seems inane.

    At the day's end I'd like to think that awards are distributed by people who are much closer and involved with the players we only get to watch on TV and so if they decide that a player deserves something then well over 90% of the time they are correct.

    I see people here rating players in categories like Speed, Skill and Passing as if it were a computer game. Now I am not saying there isn't a significant value to mere fan observation but really how can your assessment as a mere fan carry more weight than the kudo's a player has earned already in his career?

    I was arguing last night with some friends that by his records Ronaldo is probably the best striker to ever play.....I was opposed immediately and on what grounds? A mate of mine suggested Klinsmann another Weah....on the basis that they think from watching these others that they had better skill or technique etc.

    Now understand the ignorance.....I am telling them I acknowledge how good those players were but by what Ronaldo has achieved it makes him better than they were...

    Basically that is the problem...how can your personal feeling take precedence over fact. And many times I see it happen here on Soccerlens. When someone FEELS like a player is shite they talk like it is a fact. That is annoying for me.

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  2. Hamburg
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    Posted 8 months ago #

    well, i like to judge a play on what he has done through out his career, so if it means comparing a Ronaldo(Brazil) to say Torres, i will still say Ronaldo is a best player. so i alway but his peak performance(seen it or not) first before his current form. so if i compare Mikel now to Hargo(who is injured) i will pick Hargo.

    well this is a very grey area. one person may like this player more then the other, it is how he likes football, so prefer Beautiful football, some are more tactical, just like how national coaches play the matches. it is like Rock, Scissors and Paper. now right or wrong, just how you see it.

    my 2 cents.

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  3. JimKnuckles
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    Posted 8 months ago #

    I think that players should be rated by their stats. They should be from a reputable source (Opta etc.) and should really be put into context with a bit of logic and reason. (could be where the arguments begin!!) For example, if two goalies both have 32 shutouts in one season and one is in EPL the other in MLS; common sense tells you that the feat is harder to do in the EPL and the better goalie should be the goalie from the EPL. A good example of this is Romário’s GPG (goals per game) record. It is consistently phenomenal but if you look at some of the leagues he has played in you may begin to question the feat. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romario) Dirk Kuyt is another good example. Before joining Liverpool his GPG was amazing. Liverpool will be lucky if he breaks double figures in the league this season. Through all this in with the era the player played in and the achievements they may or may not have won and make a decision... and prepare for everyone else to tear it to shreds!!

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  4. AhmedShah
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    Posted 8 months ago #

    Stats dont tell everything. What if someone knows nothing about football and finds that same stat you mentioned about two GK's ? They'd know nothing about the MLS and the BPL and would just think both are great GK's. Stats dont tell the full story.

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  5. JimKnuckles
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    Posted 8 months ago #

    I totally agree...
    "...should really be put into context with a bit of logic and reason..."

  6. BRaZi_B0ii
    BRaZi_B0ii

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    Posted 8 months ago #

    i judge players b how much effort they put in, and how much they seem to be running, if they're not running, they're not playing. Personally I can't stand Italian football, its too boring aNd the only exiting teams to watch are the ones with alot of Brazilians in them.[Milan, roma]. (Mourinho and skill don't go together, players with flair never do well under the special one, [ quaresma, mancini, robben etc..] Thats why I love watching th e premier league, every match is exiting =]. La Liga is always fast paced as well.

  7. Rhian Joseph
    rhianjoseph

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    Posted 8 months ago #

    SO BRAZIL BOI YOU DO NOT BELIEVE THAT STATS TELL THE TRUTH MORE THAN ANYTHING ELSE....Watching and passing judgment is easy....any bloke can do that. But if we want truth there isn't any other way. Tell me a player whose stats lie about how good he really is.

  8. azz0020
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    Posted 8 months ago #

    Agree with Rhian stats r the key to how gd a player is!!

  9. scotgun
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    Posted 8 months ago #

    take a look at kris boyds stats and if u dont no the player,the stats will tell u that he's one of the most prolific strikers in the world,but if u do no the player which i do ud find out that he's nothing more than a fat lazy bastard.compare him to his strike partner kenny miller,who couldnt score in a barrell of fanny's but will run defences ragged for the entire 90 mins for club and country.going by this ud say boyd was the better striker BUT miller was the better player.I think players should be rated on how important they r to their club and country and how well they perform when it matters against big or bigger oposition.this thread is great but we will never get to the bottom of the STATS VS OPINION row,its just 1 of those things i'm afraid.

    scotland the brave
  10. Hamburg
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    Posted 8 months ago #

    well i could get Bendtner in my local league and he might score ten in every game, does that make him good? no. cuz my local league is, sadly, shit. so for every 10 goals here, it is worth 1 goal in the prem.

    but i do know that Strikers or at most Midfielders get more of the spotlight. GKs seldom get them.

  11. scotgun
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    Posted 8 months ago #

    em excuse me hamburg m8 but where do u stay? i stay in scotland so my local leauge is not that bad,kris boyd has scored 24 LEAGUE goals(so thats not including his 6 from the two domestic cups) already and thats coming off the bench most of the time,to do that in any league is an acheivment,anyway the point i was getting at was that although the STATS are quite remarkable,he's actually quite a shit player,in fact he is definately a shit player therefore stats r not the ideal way to judge a player.

  12. AhmedShah
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    Posted 8 months ago #

    SPL sucks. You cant judge anyone by how well he played in that league. Even Boumsong played well there.

  13. scotgun
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    Posted 8 months ago #

    boumsong didnt play as well as u think in scotland shah,and any way how often do u get to watch spl games.

  14. Hamburg
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    Posted 8 months ago #

    i am reside in Asia, in a country called Singapore.

  15. scotgun
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    Posted 8 months ago #

    do teams there play in the j-league?

  16. azz0020
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    Posted 8 months ago #

    Simple fact the SPL isn't that good it is ony between Celtic & Rangers 2 teams which would be lower tabe in the EPL!

  17. Hamburg
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    Posted 8 months ago #

    dude J-League and S-League(Singapore League) is different. is like asking: does English teams play in Ligue 1?

    we just had our League Champions playing in the Asian Champions League.

  18. scotgun
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    Posted 8 months ago #

    @hamburg - a was only askin dude coz a didnt no,i dont no much about football in asia as it isnt televised alot.

    @azz - the sole point in my comment was to say that facts arent the best way to rate a player and i think i proved my point.as for the spl not being gd enough,thats ur opinion although i doubt u watch it enuf to make that judgement,and if the old firm were in the premiership theyd be in the european places at least,outside manu and possibly liverpool the old firm has a bigger fan base than any club in england with the extra money theyd get for playing in the prem theyd both be massive forces in the prem and europe.

  19. Hamburg
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    Posted 8 months ago #

    no prob, just giving examples, so yeah, you got it?

  20. azz0020
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    Posted 8 months ago #

    Samaras is like one of the top scorers in the SPL yet he is only there because he was too shit for City says alot!

  21. scotgun
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    Posted 8 months ago #

    he doesnt have even half as many goals as boyd tho and he hasn't scored since the beginning of january,he's total shit,not good enuf for celtic.

  22. Michael Tuff
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    Posted 8 months ago #

    i always thought boyd was a good player.surely if a striker bangs in the goals,then fans shouldnt be too annoyed with him,unless he acts like a total cunt

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  23. scotgun
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    Posted 8 months ago #

    he's a lazy bastard duff,doesnt work for the team,always wants the ball passed to his feet if it doesnt he'll just let it run.2 weeks ago when we played hamilton he was dropped and at the start of the game when the subs were told to warm up,he refused and went in and lay on the physio's table with his hands in his pockets.the guy just doesnt understand what it means to play for rangers.(RANT OVER :x )

  24. Michael Tuff
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    Posted 8 months ago #

    wow,so he does act like a cunt.bet your annoyed ye couldnt sell him in january so

  25. scotgun
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    Posted 8 months ago #

    just biding my time to the summer then he'll be sold to the championship hopefully


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