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It is only a meaningless friendly. We use and test fringe players, not injured players, who are worht more to their club and country fit and for competitive matches.

I’m made up Gerrard is putting Liverpool first and I’d expect nothing less. Carragher too. All these prats who moan about England stars being over-paid etc. Who pays their wages? Liverpool. People like me going to games, buying the shirts etc give the club money to buy and pay top players.

Owen first England first throughout his career.. Just look where is got him.

Just to point out one thing for you it is Steven Gerrard who has the broken toe not Frank Lampard(he has no injuries) and Gerrard took pain killers for the game against Chelsea last sunday in order to play.

The Carragher comment is utter nonsense! Who can blame him when he has been one of the best defenders in Europe the last few years but yet continually gets overlooked by England. If it was just for being third choice behind Ferdinand and Terry I’m sure he could understand and respect McClaren, but with the manager opting to pick King, Woodgate & Brown before him is ridiculous. In addition he gets picked full back due to his ‘versatality’ yet he gets slated everytime he plays there. He is undoubtedly a rock defensively but people complain constantly about his obvious lack of attacking prowess. I don’t blame you Carra – YNWA!

Carragher isn’t the first to concentrate on his club before country,he never played anyway so what are England missing nothing.As a unietd fan i wish Lampard would reitre as well he never plays well for Engalnd. Maclaren knows the united lads well he will play them before Liverpool players whenever he can, once again we are seeing united supremacy Fergie told Heinze your not going to Liverpool and guess the outcome Heinze is not going Fergie rules.

another dumbass anti pool writer. use ur brains man. maclaran could have played loads of other plays and gave them a chance, the fact he always puts out almost the same players makes england one dimensional and very much like erikson’s england.

he could have given man city michael johnson, villa’s reo coker, man utd’s chris eagles, arsenal’s justin hoyte, chelsea’s steve sidwell, liverpool’s jermaine pennant, west ham’s mark noble, portsmouth matt taylor chances instead of calling up injured players anyway. these guys have quality and play their guts out week in week out. why dont they get their chances.

as for lampard and terry, why risk urself over a friendly and potential screw up ur season, i say gerrard did wad he did because he wanted to ready himself for both club and country. realistically speaking, would u rather have a fit gerrard for israel match or a lampard with a broken toe. besides lampard has never been a asset to england anyway, he shoots like he aims for the ex planet pluto.

and carragher may not be better than terry, but hes more consistent than ferdinard, and a man hus played in 2 champions league finals and the strongold in liverpool’s defence would surely be better than a half fit ledley king or wes brown. how do u think it feels to be world class and not recgonized. i bet terry and ferdinard would throw the same fit if they were passed over like that as well.

and with maclaran as manager, england are not gonna go far anyway. we see an england that can only play 4-4-2. teams with attacking flair will tear them apart. teams that play 10 men behind the ball will render them scoreless. no creativity, no chance for the inexperienced to become experienced and all the people hu play are the walking wounded. are u trying to say, this will win them the world cup or the euro championships. i think u have to stop bitching about hu decides to play and hu doesnt over a friendly and look at the bloody big picture. england needs its best in tip top condition, and they have to stop overlooking those with quality or they ll all end up like carragher.

FUCK OFF u stupid BLOG. CARRAGHER IS BETTER THAN RIO FERDINAND, STEVE MCCLAREN IS STUPID. HE DOES NOT KNOW HOW TO CHOOSE THE BEST. ABOUT STEVEN GERRARD, HE TOOK AN INJECTION BEFORE THE GAME AGAINST CHELSHIT. HE NEEDS REST NOW BECAUSE HE DOES NOT WANT TO RISK HIMSELF FROM GETTING INJURED FOR THE REST OF THE SEASONS..HE MADE THE DECISIONS. HE IS A HERO. U SHOULD RESPECT HIM. FUCK OFF IDIOT!

I couldnt give a rats arse about england. Liverpool will always come first… anyway carragher is not english, he is scouse, lets not insult the lad Paul scholes retired early and look what it did to uniteds cause. Also i seem to remember a certain mr ryan giggs who always went awol when wales were playing, only to play for united the following week.

*sigh*

Gerrard has a fractured toe, and this is a FRIENDLY say he plays someone stands on his food and snaps his toe meaning he misses the qualifiers. And he said him self if it was a qualifier he would play. i don’t see you lambasting all the other players who have dropped out of the squad with “injures” who played 90min over the weekend. So your point is completely irrelevant and stupid.

Carragher retired from international football at a similar age to Paul Scholes and Alan Shearer, and no one suggested they where being arrogant or selfish. The circumstances may be slightly different but the main reason is the same, all of them looked to prolong there club careers.

Could anyone have asked more of Carragher for the time he spent with England, playing every position but his favoured one, playing left back when knowing he’s going to be dropped for the next game, giving 110% and then still being blamed by people for not giving any width. He obviously feels now at 29 if he isn’t a regular starter for England he never will be, so what wrong with retiring letting some new blood come in (ala Campbell…).

This article seems nothing more than an unfair bias attack on two Liverpool players, so good job. I await more articles from you.

Steven Gerrard and Jamie Carragher are what you call ‘intelligent’ by not playing for the mockery of football that is England. Of course, intelligence is something you fail to relate to.

Carra said he quit because he wasn’t getting playing time and especially since that pathetic piece of garbage known as Wes Brown is somehow rated higher than him at CB by Steve McClown.

This is the worse attempt at drawing attention to one’s self, I’ve ever seen. You really are a true football fan.

your comment…’You choose to give up playing for your country because you couldn’t be arsed to try hard enough to rise above your competition?’…is in all honesty when I realised you are an untintelligent idiot on a rant trying to make up an article that makes no sense. The whole point is that he has proven to everyone in every way possible that he deserves a chance – and then Ledley King and John Woodgate get selected ahead of him. Full respect to those players but have they ever marshalled the defence the way Carragher has at Champions League level? No.Why should Carragher break his back proving what appears to be the impossible to a tool like McLaren? He shouldn’t. Now shut the fuck up and don’t ever write an article again. And Gerrard is so good, far better than Lampard, that you already know he will give ’200%’(your daft words) and will probably be the best player on the pitch come the qualifier so conversely, it would have been idiotic for England to risk him as opposed to him being a coward for not playing. You are a dick. And I am not a Liverpool fan.

stupid scousers, i swear im starting to hate you guys more than chelsea fans

wow james, typica scouser

scouseres dont deserve to be in england let alone play internationaly

The feeling is mutual you prick

Hey, Liam seeing as you care I hope Ceske Republicky knock the stuffing out of you.

Time for Finnan to “retire” from your poxy team too maybe Jamie can persuade him.

Dan we really couldn’t give a shit what you think.

* * * * *

I don’t really see it the same way as urself. First Terry needs to get his fitness back that is why he will taking any opportunity presented to him to play. Secondly, Lampard he’s taking pain killers now to play through the pain barrier for England. It has been said that he can not play together with Gerrard in the middle of the field, now he’s got the chance to prove himself. I like both of those players, they are fighters just like Steven Gerrard and Jamie Carragher. But one has to know when to say no.

Gerrard was not allowed to play with the consent of both medical staffs, that is, England’s and LFC’s. Now i don’t know what you are trying to imply by saying Liverpool are losers.

Jamie Carragher never said that he is better than Terry or Bloody Rio. Stats speak for themselves for defensive records. He took this decision when Wes Brown and Micah Richards were chosen instead of him as replacement for Terry when the latter was injured. Thats wat triggered his decision. He retired from International Football you need to respect that.

Enuf said, i hope England beats Germany.

The Carra thing is pretty cut and dry: He didn’t say anything when he was third choice behind an established central defensive pairing, he didn’t say anything when he was put out to the right back or defensive midfielder position (even though he’s weaker there)…but when the other 2 central backs in the England set up competing with Carra for those other two postions are both injured and you have a ‘must win’ qualifier coming up and you turn to the oft injured Ledley King over a guy who has played at the top levels of Europe over the last 3 seasons…and a Manchester United squad player on the flank…well the writing about your England prospects are on the wall…time to refocus your energy.

I’m an England supporter and it sucks to see Carra leave, but I can understand.

Gerrard: He has a broken foot and came out and said quite correctly that to risk his foot in a friendly (and considering the love these teams have for each other, probably a pretty tempered affair) at the risk of not only his club, but some HUGE qualfiers coming up in a few weeks wasn’t worth the risk.

I’d say the same thing here about Terry and Beckham. The clubs that pays them millions should expect him to show up for games, but England perhaps should take a more prudent course and recognize that this is just a friendly and that the money games are coming up in a week and perhaps rest them and give other players a chance to shine.

I seriously hope that tomorrow’s papers aren’t all about Terry or Becks aggrivating an injury in a game being played for pride when we’re fighting for our Euro 2008 lives

Carragher arrogabt….find your facts out first. There are plenty of stories about Carragher and if any fotballer is not arrogant it is Caraagher. Before you start despensing rubbish comments do some research. He is one of the most down to earth footballers around. If a player of his class has Brown, King and Woodgate picked ahead of them it’s hardly surprising he retired. He has been treated appallingly by Mclaren and it serves Mclaren right.

i’m not scouser idiot, i just support and great team. I’m not glory seeker like you!!

frank, go away glory seeker

dan un-official liaison did your mum turn your computer on? Because I doubt you have the intelligence to. Blogs and forums like this are to incourage debate, yet you seem to think it is an opportunity to show off the words & name calling you learnt in the playground today.

Dear Oh Dear, A Bit of a Rant and all be it a pointless one.

Terry and Carragher are the best CB’s in England and most of the world and I would think that Carragher position is the correct one based on the fact the England manager is just a copy of Sven and doesnt know his arse from his elbow. Gerrard is injured and well Lampard just doesnt perform in an England shirt does he? But its the same old story you cant drop Lampard..Sven wouldnt would he….

Same old England and I think the song goes Liverpool….No Heart As Big….

Ahmad…u got yrself a load of enemies wif this post…

Let’s see what will Mourinho say when lampard and terry broke a leg or sth after the friendly against germany, shall we??

If you are telling me this is a crucial game for Euro 2008 qualification, then the fact that liverpool players are unwilling to take the risk, then go ahead and shoot whatever u want…but i guess this is just a friendly that is about pride after Germany’s 5-1 defeat the last time they met.

Maybe i wont have the right to say this..but…shut yr trap!!

Let’s do a little homework before we shoot our mouths off and make an idiot of ourselves eh? OK it’s too late on this occasion for Amhed.
Alan Shearer and Paul Scholes we4re pretty much first choice selections for England and never got vilified when they decided to retire from international football.
Carragher despite being certainly in the top three best centre backs has been attending when asked and not getting games in his strongest position. As has been pointed out in other postings he isn’t even getting third place.
Carragher and Stevie G suffer from being able to play in many different positions, I think I’m safe in saying that they have played in every position except goalkeeper and they are higher than average performance in all positions certainly in effort and commitment.
They both get played out of position because they have talent and commitment in abundance which is exactly the opposite that can be said for some other players who appear to be regulars in their only capable position.
Stevie G has a fractured toe and had a pain killing injection immediately prior to walking out on to the pitch on Sunday which is one of the reasons he collected his mascot outside the tunnel and also why he wasn’t walking so easily before the game. It would be lunacy to risk the fracture becoming a break to play an international friendly and then perhaps miss sevarl competative games both for club and country. I can only assume that you are unaware of the difference in healing time between a break and a fracture. Anyone who has been a sportsman (oops sports person) might have an awareness of this. Didn’t hear too many screams from you guys when Beckham or Rooney (my appologies for the language folks) stood down for broken footbones. By the way a fracture or dislocation is classed as a break.
Additionally Carragher has said that he will answer the call and play for England if he is needed. He hasn’t turned his back on England, England could be accused of turning it’s back on him though. On that note I’d like to add that Sir Geoff should keep his gob shut considering he took a Knighthood without making any objection to the fact that the rest of a World cup winning TEAM were being ignored at the time, I find that arrogant perhaps our definition comes from different dictionaries.
You want to criticise anyone try looking at the players who regularly miss international friendlies with suspicious injuries and yet make miraculous recoveries for club games.
I remember a comment from Big Sam which was that Carragher would be his first choice as an England centerback. So why are we having to put up with less talented centre backs being played even as full backs before Carragher in the first team. Perhaps Mr McClaren can answer that.
And to add to the debate it’s probably time that Pennant had a recall. Here we have a friendly and a chance to look at options. I suggest that Pennant’s last 12 months have warranted at least a call up to the squad.
On the other hand our players answer the call and come back broken. Club over country every time.

You Mug
Why should carra work his nuts off for a crap manager who doesn’t see him as the world class player he is. Brown, King and Woodgate don’t compare yet still are preferred even when not match fit. Now a couple of injuries have left mclaren short he expects carra to bail him out then sit on the bench till he needs him at full back. Carra should be CB or nothing. Why risk Gerrard he’ll carry us through qualification if fit? Theres no benefit of him playing in a team that doesn’t resemble the one we’ll see in the qualifiers. Lampard knows he needs to shine as he shouldn’t be playing when theres a fit Gerrard and Hargreaves available. What a hero you jackass

When will you Ingerlund fans realise that most Liverpool fans (not all but most!) don’t give a shit about england!
We are only concerned with Liverpool, equally we don’t worry what the London press says we expect to get slagged and just ignore it!
There is a huge 50 foot banner unfurled regularly at the front of the Kop which says
“WE ARE NOT ENGLISH WE ARE SCOUSE”
They ain’t joking!

Sid, I seem to recall Esien being a definite doubt till the day of the match as well as many occasions when Maureen says one thing only to do another, especially with team selection. Dose anyone remember Maureen reading his team sheet against Barsa the day before the game and then played a different team? And then there’s is the Giggs situation where he was always injured before Wales games and then totally recovered for the manc games. We can pick and choose a comment here or there to argue about, but surely what Bilal has written is utter drivel and is to his usual standards. I don’t know if you’re a manc or a chav or what ever, but I would rather have a good bit of banter debating with you rather than calling Bilal what he clearly is, an intelligent idiot whose only purpose in life is to have a go at LFC.

Karl we are talking about Steven Gerrard not Paul Gerrard. What planet are u on. If England didnt have him they would be ranked lower then Northern Ireland. He doesnt need to play tonight because him and terry are the 1st names on that sheet and dont need practise. Terry needs to play because he is unfit. And Lumpard because if he pulled out he would lose his place. Ever sense lumps has been in that team they have been crap. Without Gerrard Mclaren would have been sacked and England out of the Euros. I guess everyone forgets what he did against the great Andorra. Like always he single handledly dismantled there back four. The other ten donkeys watched in amazement. Name me one English player other then Rooney who could do that under that pressure. Throughout that match Lumps was shiting his pants because of the boos. Gerrard thrives on pressure. He is what makes England a top ten team. And Scholes quit because he was being overlooked by the overrated Lumps and had to settle with playing on the left. Since when has Scholes ever played on the left. He was to scared to say so and probably couldnt be bothered cos the manager was shite anyway. Carra though stated the obvious – Why is an injured King who played less then half a season being chosen above him for CB. King is good but still players should be awarded for what they do for there club, King has won F all for his club and hardle plays.

I usually think this blogs a joke but I make this spot on for once. In response to some of the replies. Firstly this is the last chance players will have to get together and practice/play before the all important qualifiers against Israel and Russia. In that context it is very meaningful and all should have made themselves available. Particularly as they have not been together since June.

Scholes retired from international football while he was first choice in midfield. Very different from throwing your toys out of the pram and having a strop ala Carra. While I agree he’s been woefully under used (how is Brown ahead of him?) he should have the guts to prove the manager wrong.

@Grimur, Frank does have a broken toe and also played with a pain killing injection. He just has winded endlessly about it or used it as a smokescreen not to play. I’ll bet you he plays Saturday. In which case, a question. Can a fractured toe heal in a week? I’m no doctor but I don’t think it can.

@Kopite1, “Were not English anyway were scouse!” I’m inclined to agree as scoucers certainly don’t speak any kind of language I understand.

@Alex, Lampard and Hargreves also took “faced up to the spot kick” in the last world cup. A quick Google search would have told you that! But only ‘pool players have heart and bottle huh?

England will not reach next years Euros and it wont be because of Jamie Carragher,(who is right to retire) Steve Gerrard,( who is correct not to play in this meaningless game) Captain John Terry, Frank Limpsard, David Blatent, Micheal Ohno or anyone, it will be because Steve Maclaren is a crap manager, he is a bumbling idiot and he had no tactical nous. You only have to look at some of the teams he has picked and as an earlier reply stated it is so predictable and some of the players are useless. When the game is against Russia, Croatia and even Israel, Under this manager they will out fight us with more passion, determination and tactical awareness, you will see. Watch out for the becks and Limps hobble in future games to justify there crap displays . Germany will probably win tonite are it will be a bore draw, which is a good as Maclarens team will ever get, stale. If England were to get through, it will be because of Gerrard, Terry and Rooney carrying the rest of the team and the manager on their shoulders, but i cant see it as the injury’s will determine that and JT will probably get one tonight.
You should be righting mails about who is going to replace this fella, not just crying at Liverpool players. When you talk about england be objective and truthful, forget about you club allegiances, take of your rose tinted glasses and ask the real questions.

oh and idianpunk if you can’t remember what it looks like we will show you exactly what it looks like at white hart lane at the end of the season

Brian W – What does it feel like to get to the Champions League final……never
Brian W What does it feel like to get to a Uefa Cup final…..never
Brian W what does it feel like to win the Cup Winners Cup…..LOL if anyone remembers what that crap was.

Brian W what does it feel like to have no history…and im talking before blood money came along

The number one priority for any club is to win their league. By attempting to make fun of Chelsea’s European failures, you only bring about more saddness for yourself.

Liverpool hasn’t won the league in 17 years! Your history is nothing because you have yet to win any modern domestic league title. Your European success means nothing!

You still have yet to acknowledge your feelings behind your lack of history the last 17 years.

Liverpool_Fan (post 66): you idiot! remember 1999 by any chance??? also, united won the UEFA Champions League BEFORE you did, and they also won the European Cup before you did! and before you spout on about your five cups rubbish, may i suggest that if Gabriel Heinze somehow comes to your club, your players should ask him to show them what a Premiership winners medal looks like….

i dont agree with ahmed here because it does seem that his bias against liverpool is what drove him to write this article i think carraghers retirement is inexcusable even if he was overlooked its his country i for one would be honored to stay on the bench for my country any time its the pride i get for being able to help my country when needed is what really matters and i do think he is one of the best CBs in england today (although rio and terry in my opinion are better right now because one is captain of a team that won back to back league titles and the other has and is an integral part of a league winning untied) as for gerrard i think it was totally right he was rested because it was just a friendly and he is better than lampard anytime sorry franky

For me it’s always club>country. Simple professionalism here. The club pays the wages and takes care of the player. While I couldn’t care less for Carra and Gerrard, I would love it if players of my club put club over country. International football, save for a few teams, consist of teams put together playing mostly disjointed stuff usually. It’s the relatively less disjointed team that wins games.

Blue Bloke, if this blog has a point that has anything to do with football than I am Little Red Ridding Hood. You would make Maureen proud with your nonsense.

Indianpunk, no mate, Bilal doesn’t need to be PC, he just needs to think before putting words on a blog that many can read. Or else he has to live with people telling him what a plank he is. You are welcome to join him by association, as all those who can find sense in his opinion are proving one of two things, they are blinkered idiots who don’t know anything about football, or too young in the head to understand that idiotic opinions are not entertaining banter.

Nino, I cant believe you’re a manc, you cant be, talking sense like that. If you are I would stay away form the theatre of prawn as you’re likely to be lynched for having a brain. Off course I didn’t expect it to last too long.

Hannood, got too breathless reading you massive sentence that have a feeling wants to burst into many a sentence. Keep trying and one day I might be able to finish a whole one.

Bilal, “This isn’t an anti-Liverpool conspiracy (they’re good enough as they are, and if I do criticise them it’s on Rafa’s tactics, but only at times), so no point in arguing against that either.”

That’s a load of crap, just read you catalogue of back issues of your blog and you can prove to yourself what a fiction writer you really are. You are proving too much of a plank for me to stop myself calling you a plank.

Dribble, I don’t know what world you come from, but the footballing world in the planet known as Earth is a little different from such planets as planet of the numpties where its likely to find those who might love manures or chavs. Could it be your form plant of the 10 year old idiots on school holidays?

On the issue of whether there is a bias in this article:

The title is ‘England – heroes (Chelsea) and losers (Liverpool)’
If you believe Carragher & Gerrard were wrong to not represent England this week then thats one thing, but how does that justify them being called ‘losers’?

In fact Ahmed, your calling them ‘losers’ is probably what caused many to defend their football skills.

Actually come to think of it, the criticisms in your article are about Gerrard and Carragher specifically, how come your title insults Liverpool, the club? Peter Crouch is a Liverpool player, so even if you feel Carragher and Gerrard have done so wrong, it independent of Liverpool.

I’m afraid there is some bias here, which is fair enough, after all it is your site. But such bias will lead to soccerlens becoming less of a site for all football supporters.

I totally agree with the Juve fan (post 75). I was saying the same things in the pub before the game and after the game. Being a Liverpool supporter I was quite disapointed to see Gerrard pull of the friendly when Lampard had a similar injury but such is life. Also, Hargreeves pulled out of the squad with sore knees….probably another case of not being fit for England, but 100% for the weekend, like Gerrard and all the strikers that have pulled out!

plus united dont have the trophy you have to win it 5 times!!!!

Scoring 20+ goals three seasons on the trot could lead you to that perception. But of course, because he’s plays in the same position as St Stevie Me of Bootle MBE he must be crap right?

When are Lampards denfisive abilities anywere near gerrards? They may have similar abilities but i was just saying lampards role is less responsible because hes got the brilliance of essien to back him up

Were as Alonso isnt the strongest nor most defensive plaer witch gives gerrard less freedom anyway take away Lampards close range free kicks and penaltys and how many has he scored then?

And may i also remind you lampard has had three more seasons than gerrard has and Lampard is 2 years older!

I think all players names have different skill sets and all good players. Obviously supporters of certain clubs will follow there players more passionatly.

What gets me down was there was no passion last night 1 from the players who didnt go and none on the pitch. last night bar the first 10 mins was shocking. All that talent, all that ability and it was a crap match

England need a capable manager – Mclaren was always the wrong choice.

Maybe with a decent manager, a team that fulfills it potential – all the players (SG\FL) will be able to play together in a positive winning squad.

1 more after this, go go!

David i love english football the crack the atmosphere and the players i believe the best footbaler exists in the premiership Kaka, Ronaldinho, David Villa great players but they were born to play footy playing in the premiership takes years of practice and i have alot of respect for foreign players who are succesful in the EPL such as Ronald Henry, Tevez and hopefully Torres lol

Frank you plank,how the hell have you managed to come to that conclusion ?
How in anyway was my pointing out that it was the Ginger midget who walked away and spat his dummy out in anyway me sticking up for scholes ?
And how the fuck can you come to the conclusion that i am a manc when i have bashed a scum player is beyond my understanding of the English language.
Good god take yourself back to school.

I don’t think Gerrard was wrong in sitting, and although I hate the scousers, he probably made the right decision. But, Gerrard is Vice Captain, one of the best players on the squad, and the match was against Germany, and I personally think he should have been in there.

A note: the Liverpool fans have finally realized that winning the CL means shit compared to not ending the league title drought for 17 years, as they have stopped defending themselves altogether.

To whomever said Gerrard was the best at his position in the world: I want whatever you are on, because Rafa doesn’t even know what Gerrard’s position is, so I doubt you do either. And for any sake, we’ll say central midfielder, he is NOT first choice for a World XI. Ronaldo, however, IS for a winger.

Cheers to my injured Blues bringing it to the Germans all game. If you watched closely, a lot of the heart and skill in that game was on display by my beloved skipper Terry, Lamps, SWP and Joe Cole. Props to them and the other blokes except Robinson who showed up.