“The funniest of which is that ‘We aren’t Champions of England so we can’t be among the best in Europe’. Everyone forgets that AC Milan were over 20 points behind Inter in the Scudetto last season when they won the European Cup, even without the point deduction, no-one seems to mention that.”

You can (and did) win the CL without being among the top 8 sides in Europe (so did Porto). It depends on where you draw the line in terms of ‘best in Europe’

You did note that the year Liverpool won it they finished 5th in the PL. Your point about Milan last year is also well noted. Both finalists last year had nothing else to play for and could rest players in league matches during the latter stages of the season ensuring that they were fit and rested for Europe. Other clubs (Man Utd/ Chelsea) had no such luxury as they were in a dogfight for the PL and the FA Cup. This has become a real factor in the CL in recent years. With teams finishing 3rd and 4th in their leagues being given access it is happenning more and more that teams who are out of contention in domestic competitions have an advantage. Not one you’ll want to acknowledge of course, but there you go.

Quote 2 from Shaun Daley:
(Also the fact that Milan beat an ‘understrength’ United side in the semis. Piss off, United played awfully and were resoundly beaten, end of.)”

United’s success last season (and this) is underwritten by an outstanding defence. The first choice defence is:

Neville Ferdinand Vidic Evra

Home leg against Milan the defence was:
O’Shea Brown Heinze Evra (and Heinze wasn’t match fit)

Away leg the defence was:
O’Shea Brown Vidic Heinze (Vidic was rushed back from injury and not fully fit.)

Yes, Milan played very well and United didn’t but if you think the defensive injuries United had had no bearing on the contest then you’re deluding yourself.

The funniest of which is that ‘We aren’t Champions of England so we can’t be among the best in Europe’. Everyone forgets that AC Milan were over 20 points behind Inter in the Scudetto last season when they won the European Cup, even without the point deduction, no-one seems to mention that. (Also the fact that Milan beat an ‘understrength’ United side in the semis. Piss off, United played awfully and were resoundly beaten, end of.)

The next is basically us reds doing our best to defend the manager and the squad. Liverpool are moving in the right direction but the squad that Rafa has assembled is not yet good enough.

The list of signings above made me think. Are half of those players good enough? The answer is no, they’re not. Granted with decent coaching and management the likes of Lucas and Skrtel will be decent players for this football club. But beyond the immediate first team…

Reina
Finnan Carra Agger Riise
Masch Alonso
Benayoun/Kuyt Gerrard Babel
Torres

…there isn’t very much quality there, and us reds do our best to love the players we have but sometimes we have to hold our hands up and admit the squad isn’t good enough.

I’m about to use two horrible words now; next season. Next season could be good if Rafa improves were he has to with quality, not some cheap foreign knock-offs. We need a decent right winger, a decent left winger, a decent foil for Torres and a decent full back. Then it will be an achievement if Benitez keeps out of the title race it really would.

The basis of a squad is there, its just locked away in a shrewd Spanish head. Hopefully he finds the key soon other the Yanks – or the Arabs for that matter – won’t waste time.

Rafa will get it right, given more time and more money. If DIC were to take over as a majority shareholder than it wouldn’t be surprising if they were to substantially back the manager this summer. With a little common sense they’ll come to realise that changing the manager will only led to increased instablilty which in both the short and long terms will not do LFC any favours. When Rafa has had ‘big’ money to spend he has shown that he is vary capable of getting it right. Torres, Alonso, Mascherano, Babel(potentially) anyone? Forget the bad signing hes made. Analyse the good players hes brought in. Reina, Agger, Arbeloa, Mascherano, Alonso, Crouch, Torres have all done very well for the club. It can be argued that some of those players are world class in their respective positions. Where Liverpool need to improve is in the wide areas, which shouldn’t be particularly earth shattering news to the fans. Two top wingers and two top full backs would really push Liverpool forward. There is also an argument to be made that the team does not, I repeat ‘not have to buy another forward to play alongside Torres. One who can match his quality in other words. Lest we forget there is a certain Ryan Babel waiting in the wings. As a second striker playing consistently week in week out we may well indeed see him realise his burgeoning potential next season.

How many teams that have had such a barren spell in the leauge win a Champions Leauge final and appear in another, a UEFA Cup, 3 Leauge Cups and 3 FA Cups in the interim…..?

The answer is not many. Certainly Inter went through such a barren spell themselves in Serie A. Did they win a champions leauge or let alone get to a final during their so called ‘barren years’????

NO

I think I would be right in saying that Liverpool fans don’t necessarily expect the manager to win the leauge, but they certainly expect him and his playing staff to ‘compete’ at the very least. Unfortunatley, despite his vehment defiance that he oversaw Liverpool accumulate their highest points tally of 82 in the 2005-06 season since the Premier Leauge’s inception, that simply masked over the fact that the team did not ‘actually’ compete in that very season.

As Liverpool fans we’ve waited long enough for the holy grail. Surely we can wait ‘just’ that little bit longer?

You only have to read Ollick’s response to understand where half the problem is.

Delusional!

You’re right though Ollick, Liverpool have been outstanding and terrific over the last decade, leaving all in their wake. It is understandable, as a fan, that you would be ecstatic with this. Well done!

Carry on!

I guess pride doesn’t mean squat, when you are winning the odd champions league title and other mickey mouse cups.

The Man Utd 18 included Scholes, Giggs, Brown, Fletcher, O’Shea. Just behind these are Simpson, Eagles and Welbeck (who occasionally get a game) and of course Gary Neville if he ever comes back. A year ago it could have included Richardson and Rossi (who were sold for 12 million between them).
Now, Fletcher, Brown and O’Shea may be pretty average (all internationals though) but we would probably have to pay 15 million for all 3 if we had to buy them. Add that to the 12 million for the other 2 and you have enough money for a Rooney or Torres. The policy at Man Utd seems to be to buy the world class players and develop the squad players for next to nothing.

I suppose Benitez hasn’t had long enough yet to bring through youth players but it seems that the Liverpool transfer funds are spread thinly on 20-odd 5 million pound players.

By the way, Michael, I didn’t write the article. I’m just agreeing with it!!